Who would win in a war between the U.S and China?
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M$28 Answers
The Art of War, Game Theory, political science background
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M$
It's sad to say, but both cultures aren't known for backing down or quitting - both also have the latest greatest weapons and arms, both have massive armies, both have the supplies and industry.
I believe that if it were to go down, both countries would slug it out until the bitter end - so much so that neither would ever be able to recover - and possibly even the rest of the world would be thrown into a serious power struggle for "top dog" which would lead to more war....
War... it never changes....
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M$
The Chinese are completely incapable of launching any invasion a few hundred miles beyond its shores, they simply lack the infrastructure and the logistics to accomplish it. So a full scale invasion to the US mainland is impossible. In the event of a land war starting say from the Korean penninsula, in my opinion, would quickly escalate into the use of tactical nuclear weapons after American airpower literally decapitates the Chinese infrastructure finally resulting in a full nuclear exchange most likely involving Russia then Britain, France and spreading to regional nuclear exchanges in the mid east. You know, Armageddon.
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M$
their air force is complete crap our A-A missles have over 16x the range and 8x the accuracy of theirs good luck even touching a well-armed flight of raptors (not only that but the raptors themselves have the speed to fly by and blow the entire chinese airforce to pieces without them knowing what happened
The Pacific ocean is pretty big and full of American military bases. So if China wanted to invade the US they would first need to cross thousands of miles of hell, island by island before they ever reached the North American continent. You'll also need to completely destroy the US navy to get there and i would think that would be a very difficult task. Once there China would not only be fighting the US. Canada, Mexico and most nations in the western hemisphere would fight alongside the US.
The Chinese position in the world however is very insecure. Virtually surrounded by enemies or potential enemies. South Korea, Taiwan, The Philippines, Australia and many others but most importantly Japan are close allies of the US and host thousands of American soldiers, aircraft and perhaps nuclear weapons. Japan doesn't have a very large military right now but that could change in a hurry if WW3 was happening in their back yard. Although defeated in WW2 Japan is still a very wealthy and technologically advanced nation and China would need to either invade and occupy or destroy Japan before any invasion of the west could begin. The role that Russia and India would play in this scenario is less clear but equally as important. Were just one of these nations to ally itself with the west, and I think it's likely both of them would, China would be in a very, very difficult position strategically.
There's one acronym that spells defeat for China in a total war with the US, N.A.T.O. The U.K, France, Germany, Canada, Italy, Spain, Norway, Poland, most of Europe is a part of N.A.T.O. The close cultural, historical, diplomatic and military ties between North America and Europe would play the most crucial role in this WW3 scenario. The combined military, industrial and economic clout of this collection of nations is substantial, far beyond China's. China's position in this scenario is similar to Germany's in WW2. Both capable peoples and military's but in a very bad position strategically and diplomatically.
Conventional warfare is not what is going to determine victory in this situation though. The US has an advanced missile defense system and although it's not 100% effective(to my knowledge) i believe the damage that the US would receive from a Chinese nuclear strike would be much, much smaller compared to what China would receive. The Chinese could inflict horrible damage but the US and it's allies would survive because of their missile defense and in return China would be destroyed completely. Nuclear weapons are capable of quickly killing billions of people without one soldier setting foot on enemy soil. Manpower advantages are obsolete with these weapons.
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M$
I couldn't post my comment, but this is unequivically the correct answer. Population, not fully trained or experienced or equipped, and not used to fighting guerila warfare, and chinaisn't Jungle like Vietnam. We would control the seas with help from European allies, and the Air and bombard targets for months. China has no chance now, of asustained attack around US soil. Only way for China is to hold out for Armistace or threaten nuclear strikes.
Also, until 15-20 years ago China was basically a third world country. Experience, training,technology,Navy, Airforce all overwhelming edge toUS. Plus, the US hasn't fought a war that citizensfuly supported since WwIi. China would beconsidered a real threat and without threatening or using Nuclear weopans could possible hold their country but at huge loses, and would not be able to sustain any attack on the US from US territorial waters.
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M$how are they gonna colect? and as for nukes? they wouldnt be used but if they were we have patriot
they dont.
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M$
you. But today, I honestly do not know. In my heart I feel it would be a total
devastation for the whole world. The Chinese government has built and
achieved things that scare me. They are a strong and regimented nation.
I do not see them backing down from anything, no matter what the outcome
would be.
Just my opinion
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M$Now that we got the formalities out of the way, we can concentrate why US can win the war on chinese soil.
NOTE: this battle on chinese soils, is I repeat an all out war, with no f*****g ENVIRONMENTAL BULLSHITS saying "its so unecological" and peace callers saying "arrgh stop the damn war man" and that each side supports the war to its fullest and there is no holding back, all of their last resources shall be used.
Currently the war in Afganistan is a hair raising turmoil (as said on media) but truth speaking, it is only because of mass funding that section of the defence government and their loss of troops, that people are saying that the US can't keep their soils and name peaceful. I do aknowledge that the US is in financial debt currently to Japan and China because of their maintainance in Iraq and Afganistan. Also no hostages will be held, people will be slaughtered and massacred during the wr on China.
Soldiers & Land Warfare
Now currently America possesses more military power than China, by a long scale. In fact if we had to compare China and America, America would be off the chart. Even if China had a population of 4:1 not every single man, woman and child is going to attend the war and this is china were speaking of, where their soldiers are inexperienced by a vast majority. China currently only uses about 800000 approximately men on active service and is decreasing due to training expenses. America has only 300000 approximately, but these 300000 soldiers are more experienced, and harden for war. As America has been in so many wars, their knowledge of warfare is vast and their experience great. Its true that America hasn't proved to be a powerful force in the middle east, or the Vietnam war because of their circumstances. Where the war was more gurellia warfare rather than upfront warefare and their currentl financial crisis. Not only that America fought under a war in thick forests(vietnam) and mountains and sandstorms(Afganistan & Iraq) where conditions were harsh and brutal, with America not being accustommed to these very new circumstances America suffered harshly. China is an upfront country with rural and urbanised area, which American ground soldier are expert in breaking in and destroying.
The tanks that China currently uses isn't even in the world scale, their type 99 is pretty much a rolling trash can in comparision to America world reknown - I REPEAT - WORLD REKNOWN - M1A1 Abrams tanks, their LAVs and all their other vehicles the ground would surely be a superior military force. Since pretty much the type 99 is still a 4th generation tank in comaparision to the 6th generation tank M1A1 (Note type 99 was made around the time of the Vietnam War). To note, chinese tanks don't even have reactive armor, which means once its been shot at it pretty much the end for it. The Abrams tanks on the other hand have 3 lives as reactive armor blows up the bullet shell before it hits the tanks and explodes on impact. On a extra note all other chinese military vehicles are even worse than the type 99, asit is the type 99 remains "state of the Art" for the chinese military.
Aero Fighting
America pocesses the most advanced airfighting vehicles, technology and personnels on this planet. The powerfullest dogfighting plane YF - 22 Raptor (google it if you think I'm lying) is the greatest plane, currently. Not to mention the American bombers which would soften up the 4:1 population to an all time low. The Studkov 22 (yawn) is well ok - but its still old and proably can't match the YF - 22. Although good job China
Navy
America still possesses the most powerful fleet of naval units and vehicles known to man, China has decaying and outdated naval equipment. It not surprising that the land army still uses flame throwers. Back on track, China has NO aircraft carrier, Aegis crusiers to shoot down those stukovs that get in any range of the navy units. Truth speaking America more experience and grit, China only has quantity not quality.
Financial Factors
Yeah..yeah you have to admit China does have a powerful and growing economy. I'll also raise the issue that China has over the years been quite a formidable foe to the Americans in economy but in comparison of military power and research, China can't match. America spends about 1.531 trillion dollars and china currently spends 54 billion dollar. Think I'm lying? Google it then...
This mass amounts of expenditure makes America the most powerful Superpower, as it is with researched technology, America has attained state of the art military vehicles and personnels which are literary killing machines. Althought not a maintainance machine. Currently the world sees that America is weakening force because of deaths per day and stuff like that in the media about their flaws in the middle east. Why don't we re - exam the ACTUAL situation without exaggeration.
The only reason why America is failing in the middle east is because they must MAINTAIN the peace. The soldiers were built to kill not keep peace. If we see the break in of Saddam's small empire, his whole empire was broken in a short 3 and a half weeks by a handful of rangers, special ops units and air support.
If we look at the 1991 Gulf war, a short and effcient win by America once again or the civil war in El Salvandor, another quick win. As it is, same will go for China.
China remains quite initmidating but not deadly. America is both.
America has all the power in its will to decimate China if it wished. If all hope fails America can literary blow up all of Chinese grounds three times over with their nuclear weapons. As China only has 20 ICBMs America has over 12000. Think it's a lie google it then from the national statistics.
It is said that China has a history of war (sweet jebus...), and that their tactics of warfare is so much better. I really think we should put the word 'ancient' in front of warfare to make the Chinese military sound more realistic. Their last major war as in the Korean War! and that was only an ASSIST!!!!
People with such board minded thoughts of the world, know of no idea of what the world is. China is strong but America is the strongest. America truelt has attainable hopes, no not hopes...definate future of crushing China in an all out war. Although in 50+ years time it would seem unpredictable as China's growing economy is growing uncontrollably. Although I just hope the Chinese become too desperate and use their Kung Fu to defend themselves.
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M$
Ok this is getting ridiculous, I don't usually do personal attacks but seriously, how can you possibly call yourself a military theorist, a few facts I have no idea where you got:
Type 99 MBT is not a Vietnam war era tank, the very original design may be based on the Russian T72, but like every other MBT in the world the tank is constantly being updated with the latest technology. Saying the Type 99 is Vietnam war era, is like saying the German Leopard 2A6 is from WWII.
Also, YF-22 was an experimental aircraft built by Lockheed martin sell planes, the correct name is simply F-22, if you want to call yourself a "military theorist" at least get the name right.
What exactly is this Studkov 22 that you keep on talking about, from the context it sounds like you're talking about a Chinese plane, but I've never even heard of it, and also can't find anything information on it. I'm usually pretty on top of any development in military technology, but I you knowledge may be more than mine here, so if you would please show me some information on this Studkov 22 I would really appreciate it
Now that that's taken care of, let go down your list one by one.
Using your numbers of 800,000 and 300,000 active military personnel, assuming that the US soldiers have better training, it doesn't change that fact that during a time of full scale war, there would likely has to be general drafts with soldiers on each side reaching at least into the millions, at which point that 300,000 is going be fairly insignificant, and I know for a fact almost all students in China must spend at least one of their summers in military training.
Back to the tanks, I don't know exactly why you think the Chinese tanks are terrible, but the true is almost every verifiable aspect of the Type 99 is better than the M1A2. 125mm Smoothbore vs. 120mm, faster road and country side top speed and range, and a higher power to weight ratio likely means faster acceleration as well. The fire control systems on both tanks are almost identical. In terms of armor, since that's classified information there's no many ways to do a fair comparison, but what is known is both tanks employ composite materials as well as ERA technology, and online estimates have put the frontal armor for both tanks in the 600mm range in terms of the steel thickness equivalent, which is pretty standard these days. The M1A2's clear advantage is the field right now is its massive support system when it comes to battlefield management and data distribution, but that might not be the case in a war with China, I'll talk about that later. When it comes down to it, the M1A2 is a tank design to fight in a asymmetric war against insurgents, its main focus is crew survivability, which is not essentially a bad thing, but strategically speaking, it could be costly. One well known example is the fact that the ammunitions compartment is actually place outside of the main armored areas, close to the engine, it means the crew will had a higher chance to survive but the down side is that its relatively easy to immobilize compare to say a Leopard 2A6.
In terms of aero warfare, there's no doubt the US has the advantage, but operating out of Guam, Okinawa, or even Jeju for the number of sorties that's needed to "take out China's infrastructure" is simply impractical. The USAF prides itself on the F-22 and B2's stealth technology, but it's not exactly the be all and end all of aero warfare. The F117 which was the state of the art technology at the time during the Kosovo invasion was tracked and shot down by Serbian Militias using old Russian long wave radar technology. China is pouring massive amounts of money into anti stealth technology, the B2 may have a radar cross section of a small bird, but last time I checked birds don't fly at 541mph. Also about that 20:1 kill ratio that I keep seeing, keep in mind that its internal weapons bay can only hold 6 AMRAAMs and since the USAF uses a shoot-shoot-look technique, it means the maximum ratio per sortie is 3:1. Once again the stealth planes are still just a fear weapon against countries like Iran and N. Korea. Why do you think the USAF declined the total number of order for the F-22 to just 187. My opinion is that that tricked Lockheed Martin into researching it by dangling the 650 order in front of them, when there was never an intension to deploy the F-22 on a large scale to prepare for war against China or Russia.
When It comes to navy, the Chinese navy sucks because platforms like a aircraft carrier is mostly use for offensive reasons, and China never really indented to invade anyone. But one thing is for sure, anti CBG technology has always been on the top the of the priority list of the military in China. Check out the stats for the C-802 family of anti-ship missile, not exactly pushovers, I wondering how the USS America CBG will fair when 50 of those are flying towards them 4 meters above the sea level at mach 1.5.
The U.S. has the best military in the world, there's no doubt, they better for all the money spent, but when it comes down to a war with China at its footsteps, the US military simply aren't designed for the job. One of the biggest advantages the of the US in all its past conflicts has been its vastly superior information technology channels, and battlefield command and management, and the backbones of that system are the satellites. Why dose you think the US made such a big deal out of China tests ASAT missiles in 2007? You can bet if a war starts today, the only thing left orbiting the earth by tomorrow will be the moon.
Now the best part, strategic planning and economy. In terms of spending, let's put the numbers into prospective. I hope the US isn't spending 1.5 trillion, that would be more than 10% of GDP. You might be looking at the number that takes into account the interests on past wars, veteran related expenses, as well as homeland security, I can't really see how those can helps the military strength, average estimates put the DOD budget at around 700 billion for 2010. And since almost half of that 700 billion is directly related to the wars in the middle east which again doesn't really contribute to military strength in a war against China, a fair estimate for the budget if the US was at peace instead would be around 400 billion. As for China, official numbers are 78 billion for 2010, but estimates go way up, the more conservative average being around 100. Now since the vast majority of that money is spent in China, factoring the purchasing power, the new number would be around 200 billion. So it's more like 400 billion vs. 200 billion, also keep in mind that the late comer always has an advantage when it comes to cost of research, as technological secrets always has a way of slipping across borders.
To the point that someone else made about the U.S. still having a bigger economy, that is true, however, banks like Goldman Sacks hardly contribute a country's war strategic abilities at times of all out war, in fact most of the service sector which makes up more than 3 quarters of the in U.S. don't really help. It all comes down to primary and secondary industries, manufacturing, mining , farming for example. So the "hard" part of the US economy only accounts to about 3.3 Trillion, compare to the 2.8 Trillion of China, and that's nominal, take PPP into account, and its 3.3 vs. 5.6, still think the U.S. economy will help?
Lastly there's the matter of WMDs, yes China has a lot less, but it doesn't take that many to completely devastate a country like the US, where 82 percent of the population lives in cities, the largest 10 metro areas along account for a third of the population, and it's safe to say if nukes were used on that scale, even if the missile defense system stopped most of them, as long as a few gets through, the US would be greatly crippled, which means it would be extremely open to attacks from countries like say for example Russia, which means the US would likely have to launch nukes against them as well, triggering a response, at which point we all lose.
When it comes down to it, I think who wins depends on where the war is fought, if it's at China, then China will win, if it's the U.S. then the America will win.
@sammycho, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever read. At no point in your rambling, incoherent post were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational point. Everyone on this forum is now dumber for having read it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
@spkg, thank you ;)
US vs China will most likely never happen (fingers crossed) as ensured mutual destruction, beyond recovery would be the outcome for all parties involved.I've yet to read anyone surmise (other than what was briefly mentioned by spkg above) what Russia's reaction would be. I can't imagine Russia remaining neutral in such a conflict. Russia would have way too much to lose and way too much to gain and are to big of a regional power to maintain neutrality if such an event was to occur. Russia would support China, albeit, maybe not on an official level at first but the enemy of your enemy is your friend. China and Russia already co-operate with each other in their own region and both already have well established opinions on US military activity, neither being positive.If the US dared, or were stupid enough, to attempt an invasion of the Chinese mainland they would find an enemy of which they have never faced before. Anyone who thinks the Chinese are still villagers in straw hats with pitch forks are seriously ignorant of the facts. The sheer land area of mainland China and the size of its population alone makes the idea of invading it, ridiculous. Just as it would be impossible for China, thanks to the US' military might, navy and defense systems, to invade mainland USA. It would be similar to how it would have gone if war had of broken out between the Soviet Union and the US. Naval battles and lots and lots of Aerial warfare, but mainly it would be missiles etc fired from tens to thousands of kilometers away. Obviously I could talk about nuclear weapons but clearly if any party was to go down that route we all know what the end result is, and so do they. So for arguments sake I'm going to leave them out. An attack on the Chinese mainland by the US or any of her allies would be seen by Russia as a very real threat. If they had maintained neutrality up until this point, that would change immediately. If you are American and are reading this and you don't agree on that point, ponder this for a few seconds.. how do you think your government would react if Russia was to invade Canada or Mexico?The US would would have to commit so much to an invasion attempt of China that it would not be able to deal with Russia entering the conflict let alone a full scale attack. Of course, the US has her friends as well, my country included, and she would not be alone but the reality is that it would turn into a world war on a destructive scale never seen before and the world would never be the same again. Life as you know it would be forever changed...that's if you survive.
Now...back to trying to figure out wtf a “Studkov 22” is... haha.
i completely agree with basically everything just one note : the anti-ballistic-missle tech the US has can completely stomp on the entire chinese arsenal (which isnt much anyways haha)
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M$@spkg, thank you ;)
US vs China will most likely never happen (fingers crossed) as ensured mutual destruction, beyond recovery would be the outcome for all parties involved.
I've yet to read anyone surmise (other than what was briefly mentioned by spkg above) what Russia's reaction would be. I can't imagine Russia remaining neutral in such a conflict. Russia would have way too much to lose and way too much to gain and are to big of a regional power to maintain neutrality if such an event was to occur. Russia would support China, albeit, maybe not on an official level at first but the enemy of your enemy is your friend. China and Russia already co-operate with each other in their own region and both already have well established opinions on US military activity, neither being positive.
If the US dared, or were stupid enough, to attempt an invasion of the Chinese mainland they would find an enemy of which they have never faced before. Anyone who thinks the Chinese are still villagers in straw hats with pitch forks are seriously ignorant of the facts.
The sheer land area of mainland China and the size of its population alone makes the idea of invading it, ridiculous. Just as it would be impossible for China, thanks to the US' military might, navy and defense systems, to invade mainland USA. It would be similar to how it would have gone if war had of broken out between the Soviet Union and the US. Naval battles and lots and lots of Aerial warfare, but mainly it would be missiles etc fired from tens to thousands of kilometers away. Obviously I could talk about nuclear weapons but clearly if any party was to go down that route we all know what the end result is, and so do they. So for arguments sake I'm going to leave them out.
An attack on the Chinese mainland by the US or any of her allies would be seen by Russia as a very real threat. If they had maintained neutrality up until this point, that would change immediately. If you are American and are reading this and you don't agree on that point, ponder this for a few seconds.. how do you think your government would react if Russia was to invade Canada or Mexico?
The US would would have to commit so much to an invasion attempt of China that it would not be able to deal with Russia entering the conflict let alone a full scale attack.
Of course, the US has her friends as well, my country included, and she would not be alone but the reality is that it would turn into a world war on a destructive scale never seen before and the world would never be the same again.
Life as you know it would be forever changed...that's if you survive.
Now...back to trying to figure out wtf a “Studkov 22” is... haha.
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M$
when it comes to citizens i think it would be the opposite of what you said. I don't know what would happen if the war was on US soil, but if China gets invaded, you cant bet that almost citizen will become a militia. Even if most of the people hate the government (which I don't think is true to begin with), the Chinese also always been known for being ultra nationalists. All you have to do is look back to Japanese invasion during WWII, vast majority of the population hated the KMT government, but it certainly didn't they fought their own government, in fact the exact opposite happened, the two sides that was fighting a civil war before WWII joined forces and fought the invaders together.
If this ever did go down, then both USA and China will lose. WW3 and yeah lets hope it does not happen, or ends quick.
I think where the war occurs will determine its winner. Also, i dont think China can feed all of its people during a war time. Food goes to army, population gets pissed and revolts. Then they would be fighting 2 wars. Similar situation could occur USA (not food).
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M$
WW3 wouldnt happen if the war ended in a couple months (which china would be forced in to because of the U.S.'s insane tech. advantages)
not really.............. the us has trianed soldiers for every climate now including dessert due to the invasion of iraq.
china would devied its self and alot of persons would come and fight for the us.the only thing china has in its faver is gongel warfar but the us lernd how to fight in vietnam.thar is alot of vietnes chines and other small peaple can snech in tonels under grand. the us can fight so derty like the chines can.
The US has more naval destroyers.
The conflict will never happen because of the doctrine of Mutual Assured Destruction. Nuclear superpower countries don't attack other nuclear countries.
American Lake : Nuclear Peril in the Pacific
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M$
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M$China may have more people but USA has better technology. really? we don't know because now adays everything is hidden. we don't know which country is better because both develop techware secretly not revealing anything to the general public. we don't even know that if the official numbers of armed forces are even true.
lets not forget that we've seen Americans first fight in Korea, then Vietnam, then Iraq and then Afghanistan. all through the countries Americans have faced both victories and defeats. if we understand that the Iraq war cost about $ 1 trillion in just 10 years, it effectively shows that the American military is not very affective in strategy and they spend too much.
considering the economical advantages, China controls the world's production, cutting the production will put the whole world in anarchy including Europe and the whole of North American showing that Americans could not invade China even if they had the capacity to.
Fine, america is the best but a war is no longer won by the number of people. it is won by technology and strategy. Chinese are known for their smartness yet so are americans. if we take both countries into consideration we have to see which country is best. lets take USA, Asians basically run the whole of New York businesses e.g. laundries e.t.c. if a war breaks out they will riot. if we take China, china today is buying american bonds therefore taking its economy into its grasp
The future war is not all about military, its about economic advantages. intially the Chinese would have planned a military attack but after seeing the Japanese defeat its clear that America can only be starved out to become defated. this can only be done by ruining the economy. the attack of Afghanistan and Iraq was not just because of 9/11 but also to secure themselves from seeing another depression like the 1929 depression. This concludes that Americans needed resources to manage the recession.
as for the nuclear arsenal, we don't know whether american defence systems work because they've never been effectively tested. STARWARS was a failed project, how come the new defence isn't. having 10000+ nuclear warheads does not win a war. you need money to maintain and as a democratic country, the USA cannot order workers to work without paying them if China does starve the US economy
the war in middle east has already exhausted american budgets showing that no one country can go against another country big or small and win without taking very heavy damage.
the USA is great and all but the signs of its collapse are beginning to show. a new world power is going to take over, an asian country, the time for whites is over and time for asians and indians is going to begin.
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M$
You are so wrong at this juncture. First off who says it has tobe on Chinese soil? Secound, disregarding Nuclear Weopans, currenty the most technologically, experienced naval and airforce/air supremacy belongs to all allies of the US. All of Europe, the US, Cqnada, etc. Only major allies, forget economics, bc if a war breaks out and no Nuclear weopans are used, the country that takes the most devastation loses big-time economically. So our allies, in a non nuclear war,will support us. The only allies China has is N.Korea-land troups and nukes, and maybe a part of a decimated Russia, and Iran. They have Nuclear capabilities, but no Navy or air supremacy. China would be intercepted and blocked by Sea, and we would sit off-shore and sendmissilesfrom navy vessels and Subs and launch strikes on key target areas for months. Then under air support we would go in on ground to destroy or take hold of key military targets and Govt targets. China's economy would be wiped out, our debt would be wiped out.
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M$
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M$
If China demands repayment, we can slap enormous tariffs on Chinese goods -- the US and China have each other by the gonads.
If a war would break out, do you realize no debt would be given to the loser, except aid. Assuming no nukes. Do u realize that if China cashed in their stake would be worth óthing hf we repaid them? The US and world econmy woukd colapse as oe oow.
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M$
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M$Ignoring the nuclear question to make a land operation possible you must have naval dominance, an entire army would be a nightmare to insert via air. But to win the land war you would need to see who had air superiority in that particular sphere. So enough theorizing my most likely scenario...
Straight away the whole of NATO and the rest of the westernized world would become almost automatic allies, remember the European Union has the potential to be far more powerful, economically and militarily than another state or alliance in the world. That's right; the old world retains its power, but only if it sticks together.
In view of the fact that the allies would have the only two 'blue water' navies in the world (meaning that they can be deployed, operate and strike anywhere in the world within a few hours even) the US and UK followed on by support from the rest of the non landlocked EU nations would be knocking on China and or Russia's door very quickly, countering any threat of invasion on their part; and they would in my view stop that threat and limit the enemies deployment throughout the world.
If we were talking about invasion of china or russia from that point it would be 'blitzkreig' on their landing strips with special forces and airbourne units securing them, and doing what they can to destroy enemy aircraft and defense capabilities while the armour and infantry catch up. From there it would be the same thing step by step until the enemy was forced to an armstice. Not sure if that would be successful but that would be the idea... grab the air strips to gain quick air supremacy and limit the enemy.
I do not believe that would actually happen though, it would be a war focussed on cutting the enemy resources. The oil fields in the middle east and throughout the oceans would be the battleground. There would be war in Afghanistan and Iraq before anywhere else. Easy to get there for the enemy over land, and possibly easier for them to bring their aircraft into play than it would be for the allies there (that is considering that allied forces had left there since that time). This coupled with raids on the Atlantic and North Sea oil fields would really be the most likely scenario. The oil 'raids' would be fairly unsuccessful for the enemy, and it would prove impossible for them to cut the west off from their resources considering the naval resources at play here. If we win war for middle east we win the war, even if they don't know it yet (but they will). Russia does have its own natural resources to turn to though remmember this may be enough to power both countries for some time. Skirmishes, quick raids on these fields would again be the order of the day, likely with little success for either side.
Outcome: Victory for the allies in the middle east but not the end of the war immediately. It would likely end in a stalemate, they would never invade europe or america (though they would invade japan), if we can hold japan then it would likely result in a by the skin of the teeth victory of the allies. If we hold japan we hold a threat to them, a staging point for land and air operations.
Who will win?: Allies (US/UK/NATO/EUROPE)... by the skin of the teeth, with no real reward either... apart from not being occupied and still governing ourselves.
my own knowledge
studied war historically and taken political and practical considerations into view.
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M$common knowledge
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M$
i say this allso i have see what the US can do in the frist gaulf war in 1991.vietnam in the 1960S was only game between the us an udssr.this time the us would not hold bach to destroy all millitary posts and armys.the us would take a big toll in war dead but china would los a lot moor.
5 times? try 10000 times haha... im sure with our tech we will probably have space to ground missles in no time which would be unstoppable (let alone the fact that they would wreck the morale of anybody watching explosions come from no where)
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M$Also i would think that the governments of the two countries would be smart enough not to get into a nuclear conflict that could destroy life as we know it. But if they do and the world is still in one peace then both china and the U.S. would be almost completely destroyed. The worst part of it is that countries around the world would start wars for resources and for new military superpowers.
my brain
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M$
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OK but lets play with this. The USA would not launch missles from within the borders. Instead an order would go out to B-2 bombers to target the area of the launch and all addition known launch sites. With the B-2s enroute the US would wait to deliever a decisive first strike to knock out a majority of Russias launch sites. This limits their counterstrike abiltity and also doesn't allow them to launch their missles before we can knock them out.
While this is happening, the US Navy gets all Carrier battle groups who are in port on US territory to rev up and get out to sea to prevent their destruction. The US military is put on High alert and all NATO forces are reving up for war as the Military Alliance has its first true test.
Hopefully delivering a decisive first strike against Russian launch sites, the USA deters Russia from launching an all out attack. Sparing the majors cities showed Russia the USA did not want the destruction of the world, however a conventional war was definitly going to happen in response.
During this time China signs on with Russia and we have a major war on our hands. The US mobilizes all 12 Carrier battle fleets. The forward command posts get their fleets out to sea. The USA first launchs hundreds of missles knocking out both Russias and Chinas power and telecommunication systems.
With the World knowing Russia launched the first strike, few nations in the world want to interfere fearing their destruction or having to face a angry US military.
4 Pacific carrier fleets are scattered along the Chinese and Russian east coast, with one staying farther back to provide interception missions should Russia or China try to sneak their navies through. The 6th group gets the luck chore of patroling the North Sea and Bearing Strait. The Atlantic fleets sit in the Persian Gulf, Med and north of Europe. France and the UK at this point had deployed their naval forces. Russia and China have been blockaded in.
The US uses its forward bases in Japan, Italy, Germany, and South Korea to launch non-stop aerial attacks against Russian and Chinese military targets. Similar to German tactics in WW2 US led NATO forces invade western Russia tryingto occupy several major cities and hoping that the constant air support will have a devestating effect on the Russian Military.
The US uses containment against the Chinese military. Knowing they have a bigger military, but no real air or naval support they know to let the army sit there and just keep bombing them with air power.
Given the constant bombardment and threat of an all out invasion resulting in mass destruction the Russian leaders stand down and give up realizing there is no hope.
However not all is good for the US. The military does lose a lot of forces, but we still remain on top.
To all the people who think everyone would just press the red button do some research first. If they press it we press it vice versa, kind makes it pointless. Nuclear weapons will never be used as easily as people think by developed nations.Although i do not think war would ever happen because America is China's main Economy source and China has all of Americas production companies. And thats my Answer and trust me ive done my research
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M$
Very Impressive analysis, This remains very true. I'm actually a militart theorist myself and this is a precise prediction of what could happen. Although, it might not be what you would say in 50 years time.
Dude your kidding me, Air Force? Navy? China has all of that -_-. You need to do some real research, If China demanded repayment, then America would have to sell all of its B-2 Bombers and All of that other stuff. Trust you? Have you seen the history of the past of China's Wars? Japan invaded and had all better guns and everything, look who won? China, I know America helped too but now, America is in Economical crisis. My friend is Chinese and convinced me that China and all of it's allies would win, Air Force, Navy, All covered by China and it's allies. China is smarter than you think, look at all the battles with the "army" just sitting there, did I mention that in the past, China's army had taken out American Tanks without and its Army. So you tell me how the hell better technology will help. Also, China and Russia have a better relationship than Russia and America. Ever heard of Chindia or Chimerica? Also, you do know China can like by now, buy anything they want? Bombers from Germany, Fighters from Russia, Guns from France. ANYTHING. America, the just keep spending their money on Weapons. And you know why America sent out that Aircraft Carrier? To SHOW OFF to China just to say Im still stronger than you. Also, Since America didnt want to lose power when it's allies tried to join forces with China, America didnt let them. Who gives a Damn about better tech? America owes the entire world money, And with the gulf spill problem. They are in a Crisis now with almost everything. I also think that America will go broke is that they are afraid of China. They will buy like 500 more bombers to "airstrike" China. The bad part about China is that they get technology from other Countries and rebuild them. So there, Satisfied? Btw Sparan 117 your right on 1/6 of the stuff you said. How does US still remain on the top, you know a lot of americans want to change their passports to Chinese passports? and start businesses in China. While China is gaining, America is losing. You all know that China would win but you don't want you country to admit defeat. I was born in the US but I look Chinese because of my parents. So I am a Chimerican. Also Spartan 117, This line that you typed is a lie "Given the constant bombardment and threat of an all out invasion resulting in mass destruction the Russian leaders stand down and give up realizing there is no hope." Russia had very good leaders and they wouldn't stand down because China has Nukes, More than America, North Korea has tested its nukes before and has seen that is has done bigger damage than when America bombed Hiroshima in World War II. Also, Russia has nukes. So What the hell is with fearing Bombardment?
to necro for your comment : china does have an air force and a navy... both of which could be destroyed in less than 5 coordinated strikes by the US alone.... if we were at war with china could they expect being paid back for our debts? ya i didnt think so.... 1 FY-22 can engage almost 20 of China's f-15s and then still make it away from the dogfight but only because they are out of missles... 1:20 is completely insane and thats with no losses the FY-22 has one of the best stealth systems currently available and the US A-A missles have 4x the range and targetting capabilities = no chinese airforce..... the chinese navy fails.. completely... first of all they have NO weapons capable of even getting NEAR our ships without getting completely destroyed.... also their carriers have no lifts which means they cant even launch 1/10 as many planes as we could and even if they could the 1:20 thing comes back in to effect (not to mention the soon to be released for combat A-10 thunderbolt II)... then theres the population ok first off most of their natives hate their government which means there would be rebellions coinciding with our assault so they would have even more problems... their allies: even all their combines allies would stand no chance against the US let alone almost every country in europe and some other smaller countries allied with us...... China cannot buy any weapons the want most countries wouldnt sell to them no matter how much they offered (why do you think our insanely high tech and super-effective M1A2 abrams isnt in their army and they still use the outdated chunks of metal called the Type 99s which cant take more than 1 hit of the m1a2 even though its range and accuracy are unbelievably perfect)........ lastly LMAO necro you think china has more nukes?!!?? BAHAHAHA http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/mil_wmd_nuc-military-wmd-nuclear CHINA : 400 warheads US: 10350 warheads..... id say we might have the advantage in that category too haha thats enough nuclear firepower to vaporize every inch of china over 20 times.... russia would stand down along with all of china's other allies once our extreme power is demonstrated (why do you think no one is willing to go to war with us? 1 US troop is worth over 150 chinese gear-wise and could easily match that in tactics, training, experience, patriotism, heroism, bravery, and stopping power) oh and just adding in the fact that we have sniper rifles in the hands of trained combat snipers that can stop a plane taking off and others that can drop someone from almost a mile away........................................................ overall, china would have no chance no arguments can be made about that
Thanks Juanvasconez. Much appreciated.
What kind of Dope you been smoking? You ever been to China? You ever been anywhere besides a POL 1301 class? Yes China is getting stronger because we The Dems enabled them to steal technology. Fighting smarter are you sitting me? Stick to childrens games little boy.
sorry but the U.S. is so advanced that even if an attrition war was to start our tactics and technology would destroy china before they realize what's happening... for starters China's largest threat to our power (the DF21D missle system) can only reach 1500 kms which is way out of range of a fully loaded F-22 raptor or F-21 (let alone the soon-to-be-released f-35 Lightning II.... the f-22 can reach ranges of over 3200 kms and can easily eliminate the only possible threat to the US naval power. The submarines china has are the only other major threats to the ships and are easily detected and destroyed by an of the 4 ohio class submarines the US has based near China.... 1 of which carries enough firepower to destroy an entire Chinese Naval fleet and then some... once landed the US would still hold air superiority and with it the war would be over before it began because of the insane payloads of our fighters and bombers (even without air support the US marines tactics could smash the masses of the chinese army) .... goes to show that quality is farrrrrr more important than quantity (especially if said quantities can't even reach us)..... but then as the Chinese see that they have been completely devastated they would begin launching their nuclear arsenal out of desperation which could quickly be countered by any number of defenses the US has which include ship-missle, air-missle, sub-missle, ground-missle, and missle-missle defenses and it would do more damage to the Earth than it would to the US..... if they tried to take it to an economic standpoint instead we could raise the tariffs on chinese goods and they would be hurting more than us because we give them 90% of all the money they bring in and we could find other sources for it like we always have (where as the chinese probably couldnt because we send them the resources that they make our products with)...... the US power is permanent there is no contesting it because that is just a fight between the US and China if all the close allies of the US were to join the fight China wouldnt be able to scratch us
Ok The u.s would woop the chinese so fast it wouldnt be a war just a blink of an eye. We took on 20,000 british soldiers with only 2,000 u.s soldiers and 10 guns barley working. we have technology specialy made to defend against chinas weapons. This is true, the u.s has battleships afloat off the coast of japan already practicing. watch wale wars and you will see. If you study the u.s military and the chinese, you know what the U.S is capale of.
no way man. The Chinese would have tons of problems if they ever tried to invade the US with all the homeland defenses we have been beefing up since the Cold War. We have a Larger, stronger, more advanced, better equipped Navy and Air Force. The Chinese would have a huge population advantage, but the US has far more technologically advanced military weapons. Whose going to win between 1000 foot soldiers and a long range missile, or an F-16? Then you have the matter of allies, WW3. Chinese allies would include Russia and many of the smaller communist Asian nations, Russia being the most important. The US would have allies all across Europe, which is made up of stronger nations than just small communist nations, and Japan and South Korea, Japan being the most important. The three largest economies in the world are in order the US, Japan ,and, the EU(European Union), giving a distinct advantage to the US side of things. Dont get me wrong, war would be a tragic endeavor for both nations, but in the end the US would come out on top.
nice you deleted my answer...it took me a while to write that...how douche of you...go ahead and delete this too.
first off any of u who think china is so great should go live there see how happy you
are standing for hours in a lunch line to get your family food.damn commies.
now as for who would win in a fight its simple. who has the best navy/air force?
america does america can simply cut off chinas power projection by blockaiding them ensuring they can never retaliate then we can stomp them witm moabs at our lesiure.
and as for our debt? thats like expecting donald trump to beat chuck norris just beacause chuck owes him money.
NO AMERICA WILL KILL THEM
The answer from bossman has 0 tactial prowess. The United States would win this war. Fought in China or the US.
1.There is no country better then the US at fighting a standing Army or an insurgency then the US. Though it seems failed, we destroy Iraq's standing Army in 11 days in 1991 (at the time Iraq had the 5th largest Army in the world) and our lessons since 2003 have taught us how to fight an insurgency better.
2. If the war goes nuclear they would not touch our shores with missiles. The highly successful AEGIS missile defense system and our THAAD missile defense system (which has not failed in testing)would mean very few or no missile would hit any US city. Even Honolulu, which has a THAAD system in Pearl Harbor. China does not have a missile defense system nor does Russia.
3. Our equipment is head and shoulders better. Here is a list:
a. Our navy is far superior to China's across the board. Also we have Air Craft Carriers and China doesn't.
b. Our cruise missiles are highly accurate, effective, and better then China's
c. All of our Aircraft are better including helicopters, bombers, and fighters.
d. Two words "Stealth Technology" (1 f-22 has reportedly been able to engage and destroy up 16 f-15's without being engaged)
e. Our vehicles are better. We have armored troop transports like Humvee's, Stryker's and Bradley's. China uses trucks.
f. The M1A2 Abrams tank is the best in the world. Easily topping the Chinese Type 99
g. Our soldiers have better/more secure coms. Our soldiers use highly effective body armor the chinese do not.
h. Our logistical support is much better due to our airlift capabilities.
4. The US is still a much bigger economy then China. Debt has nothing to do with it. In war we wouldn't care about the debt owed to China. They do not produce any of our weapons so that would not effect war production.
5. The US has actually fought in recent wars, China has not, making our officer's and NCO's better prepared for combat then the Chinese. We also have very effective quick strike and tactical capabilities with our Air Assault trained helicopter forces and our Airborne units.
6. If it was an all out world war and it came down to allies the US would still prevail. Assuming China's allies would be Russia, North Korea, Cuba, Venezuela, some middle eastern countries like Iran, and some small countries here and there. The US would have all of the western European countries like Italy, France and Spain, as well as, countries with amazing air forces like Great Britain and Germany. We would also have Canada, Israel (which are great fighters), Australia, Japan, South Korea, Mexico, India and some small countries here and there as well. Looking at the "us vs them" thing. I think the "us" is much better.
Those reasons alone allow us to win but like everyone says it wont be good for either country. There is no reason for us to fight China.