OPEN THREAD: Obama Nazi Healthcare logo.
More: http://bit.ly/bblHD
Most intelligent, fascinating and/or funny comment--as voted by our community--gets the tip. :-)
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$19 Answers
First thing I thought when I read this was: Ok, so now Obama is not only a Commie, but he is also a Nazi? Don't these people know that the Nazis and Communists were enemies and fought a fierce battle on the eastern front during World War II?
The Nazis (or fascists) strived for excellence in everything by enduring conflict between races and nations (Mike Hawkins, Social Darwinism in European and American Thought, 1860-1945), while Communism strives for uniformity (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/communism)
Apparently, there are some that are still out to damage the current president any way they want, playing on any 'anti-' sentiment they can think of. I've seen Obama being accused of (white) discrimination, communism, and now Nazism, which all seem equally ridiculous. I guess some people are just sore losers.
As to the comparison: That's totally ridiculous. The wings are not even eagle-wings, they are wings of guardian angels. The American Eagle is more like the Nazi symbol than the Healthcare symbol, and even the (currently used!) German Euro symbol still uses the eagle:
And while we're at it, shall we also forbid buddism for re-using the swastika?
Oh, right, the buddist used it first...
Fact is, Nazi Germany re-used age-old symbols to strengthen their movement, and therefore there will be always be similarities to currently used symbols, if they are derived from the same origins.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communism
and my own opinion
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$Okay, now that I'm on Team Rush, I think it's my duty as a Jr. Rush Officer to alert all of you to some other alarming similarities I've discovered. Please alert your loved ones immediately:
According to close photo examination, Rush may be related to Nazi Dr. Mengele
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
And Rush may secretly be Mussolini as well!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
And Rush's parent company, Clear Channel may secretly have communist ties of their own. Hammer to be added once they've taken the Presidential office.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
and Jesus is a Euro-fascist!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Does any of this seem outrageous or offensive? Yeah, I think so too, just like Rush's assertion that America's health care policy is in any way linked to the Nazi party or genocide.
Listen, I'm not going to guarantee that Obama will be the greatest president ever, but should we at least TRY to root for our country's success? If he has concerns with basis in reality, I listen and question - that's my patriotic duty. But this type of hysterical garbage is a scare tactic that feeds on stupidity, ignorance, and paranoia. Rush, because of the freedoms upheld by the President, you can keep saying what you're saying and I won't ever want to shut you down. But I wish your listeners would take you for the shock jock and joke you actually are. You make money feeding people lies.
You know what else the Nazis were good at, Rush? Propaganda. You know anything about that, Rush?
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
Oh, I almost forgot the most important connection:
That's right. Rush is actually Lord Voldemort.
I always thought that Richard B. Cheney was lord Voldemort.
Some of this is on target, but you should recall that there is nothing coincidental about the similarity of Euro-fascist and Christian symbols. Fascism under Franco in Spain was closely linked with the support Catholic Church. Other varieties of Fascism often included strong support for either that church or Christianity in general, such as in Romania, Croatia, and Latin America. Of course, Fascist leaders always want complete power and have no patience with religious leaders who object; but, there is a historic connection which continues.
Actually, it's just the fact that Obama has so MANY anti-capitolists and pro-communists around him that leads people to believe he's swayed that way.
ONE thing that's curious about him;;;;;;; for a guy who is "for" the little guy, he's spent more money in ONE YEAR than Bush did in 4 years on parties and gala State affairs. He's living like a KING...... or RULER.....
Is he comparing giving middle-class and poor Americans access to the same health care that Congresspersons have enjoyed for years to Nazism? What's the ACTUAL comparison?
To me, it just seems like a somewhat unfortunate coincidence that a common Nazi symbol and the logo on the president's Health Care website share a rough shape. Not sure it's really even worth mentioning...but that's just me. I'm, you know, sane.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
Lon, point of correction. This single pay plan that Obama is proposing is *not* the "same health care that Congresspersons have enjoyed for years." That is part of the uproar, in that citizens are asking their representatives if they think Obama's plan is so great, why wouldn't *they* want that plan instead of their existing plan.
Congress has FAR better healthcare than Medicaid recipients.
Nationial Socialist Healthcare cannot afford to give "Congress-like" healthcare to the peon citizens.
The citizens will get MEDICAID.
And watch out, Obama is not the only Nazi, apparently the entire American Medical Association took their inspiration from Hitler! (Though I think they now have a new logo.)
@workingdobermann Unfortunately Obama is NOT promoting a single-payer plan. He hasn't supported that route for a few years, and those pushing for single-payer were pretty marginalized at the beginning of White House health care reform discussions. I think the White House dismissed single-payer as not politically realistic and started to compromise with Republicans/Blue Dogs too early. Now even a public option is in question. Hopefully the White House has learned that compromise is not going to be a smooth process and the far-right will will throw out lies regardless, so they might as well start with the best possible plan and work from there.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
They're all three eagles carrying something, that's about it.
Another one in the same vein is the CIA logo:
I'm not sure what eagles have got to do with healthcare, but I guess if you want symbols of the US, they're high on the list...
I think the only Nazi-like thing in the whole affair is the kind of venom that is being spewed by the Limbaugh crowd. Dr Goebbels would certainly have been at home with throwing around that kind of hate.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
The "nazi" comparison stems from the FACT that both Obama and Hitler shared the Socialist philosophy. Hitler was a right wing socialist, Obama is a left wing socialist (so far). Obama is more in line with the communist party than the Nazi party although ALL share the same basic structure of SOCIALISM.
I really don't get the point being made here. If Obama was a secret Nazi, wouldn't he be astutely aware of all Nazi symbols and thus avoid using anything remotely resembling them so people wouldn't catch on? Or, is this symbol supposed to subliminally prepare the American people for the Nazi uprising on the horizon?
Whatever the intended point, I view it as just another lame conspiracy theory perpetuated by people with such weak arguments they need to make ridiculous claims to draw attention away from the real issues at hand.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
1. He is an idiot.
2. His propaganda is misleading and harmful.
3. A bunch of other idiots believe what this pill popping lunatic says as useful.
Can you name 3 things Rush Limbaugh has in common with Nazism? Or fascism? or communism?
@samid, Rush Limbaugh is on the air because he reaches such a large audience that people are willing to pay to advertise during his breaks. It is his show and air time if he wishes to hang up on callers. Rush Limbaugh has never passed any laws limiting free press as Hitler did. He has never even petitioned the government to shut down other voices. You cannot say that a private citizen with no political power who speaks his mind during air time that he has paid for is controlling free press.
If you make a blog site that allows posted comments and you remove some you don't find appropriate, that is not controlling free speech. It is your private web space to do with as you will. If you pass a law that no other blogs should be legal, then you are controlling free speech.
@buddawriggi,
1. Nazis, fascists, and communists were not known for their idiocy.
2. Rush Limbaugh is exercising his right to free speech and is not attempting to control the press, as fascist regimes do.
3. If having people believe you makes you a Nazi, then there is no bound to the Nazism in America.
All three of these arguments could just as easily be applied to any number of democrats. Apparently, you know nothing of Nazism, except that it's okay to hate them, and since you hate Rush Limbaugh, he must be a Nazi.
Not attempting to control the press??? Are we talking about the same Rush here? He's a shock jock. Just by being on the air in the first place and being so controversial he's controlling the press. He's basically shoving down the throats of his audiences a bunch of racist, shovenistic, anti-christian poison, using "freedom of speech" as a crutch to do so. And what happens when someone with a shred of intelligence calls up to confront him on his dangerous ideologies? He talks over them and then hangs up on them. In my opinion, he's a liar, a cheat, and a hypocrit and the saddest part of all is that some people actually listen to him and hang on every word he says! Of course, there are also people who read those rag mags and actually believe bat boy is real and that Clinton's love child is half alien. So, I guess I shouldn't be surprised.
Limbaugh's rhetoric preys on the mentally helpless and misleads them into believing all kinds of misinformation. His rhetoric is the equivalent of taking an apple and an orange and saying they are the same thing because they are both somewhat round.
I am not speaking out against Republicans or conservatives, only Rush, so don't bring the political parties into this.
It would ave been a tough day in that office today.
I don't think that this would have been done on purpose. It looks like an unfortunate combination of graphic elements.
"Love him or hate him, Rush always gets people talking."
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$Ze world iss verry proud of having a preszident of mixed race. And all ze Nazi's wonted wasz n Uberrace. So ze argument of him being a Nazi does not fly wiz me.
On a more serious note ...
The problem is that designing unique logo's is very complicated and difficult. Designing logo's that can not be misunderstood or compared with other logo's or hidden symbols is close to impossible. Imagine what the reaction would have been if the designers included an eye or a spike in the logo. A simple syringe might have been identified as one of the secret symbols of the secret societies of the world.
When someone designs a logo they probably need to compare their logo to every logo in the public domain as well as traditional and cultural markings and totems.
I live in Namibia (Africa), when a local bank changed their logo to depict a acacia tree, some people saw an outline of a white rabbit in the branches. Apparenly a white rabbit is a logo for some secret society somewhere.
Another problem is bran a product naming. Choosing a name for your product is just as dicy. Volkswagen had a model called in Fox Trippa in South Africa, in german Tripper is an STD.
Microsoft went to great lenghts in finding a name for their re-branded search system (www.bing.com). They did a lot of research to make sure that bing has more or less the same meaning in most languages.
To conclude my ranting ...
Cut the designers some slack people. I am sure there is no Nazi that infiltrated the US healthcare system.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$First, notice that the new symbol uses the caduceus, or staff of Hermes. Hermes was the God of Thieves, not medicine. The somewhat similar staff of Asclepius has a single snake and no wings, and is the correct symbol of medicine.This implies that the new system will steal peoples money rather than provide medical care.
Second, notice that the logo is blue, white, and red. Those are the colors of the French flag! It is taught in French schools that "the colours of the French flag represent the three main estates of the Ancien Régime (the clergy: white, the nobility: red and the bourgeoisie: blue)" What is an American institution doing celebrating the nobility and the clergy? Not only that, but the French are notorious for drinking fancy wines and eating smelly cheeses in an effete manner. And, they nearly went to war with the USA in 1798!
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
The Young Turks give about 5 other examples of Limbaugh doing that this week.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzSNsMy98BY
It's pretty bad logic he's using, he is certainly not an elitist scholar.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
Doesnt make the US a Nazi nation!
;-)
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
Ofcoars someone could argue they used the same type of logo to market snakes on a plane.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$I found it interesting that Rush thought it easier to tie the item to the Nazi emblem than addressing this fact about the Caduceus:
"In later Antiquity the caduceus might have provided the basis for the astrological symbol representing the planet Mercury and in Roman iconography was often depicted being carried in the left hand of the Greek god Hermes (Roman god, Mercury), the messenger of the gods, guide of the dead and protector of merchants, shepherds, gamblers, liars and thieves."
Considering all the conspiracy ideas about socialized medicine leading to organized euthanasia for the old and infirm, or at the very least showing how the icon reflects Obama's supposed attempts to "mislead" America into the "New World Order", I suppose it's easier to play on simple fears rather than get in-depth about a "supposed" conspiracy that might make his listeners think rather than blindly agree.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$Whatever they were, German Nazis had very little (if any) common ground with American conservatives. Nazis were for nationalized healthcare; abortion, forced sterilization, and euthanasia for undesirables; animal rights; organic foods; protection of the environment; the state's responsibility in providing jobs; old-age welfare; public education; and centralized government control of every part of its citizens' lives. Nazism, like Italian Fascism and Russian Communism, elevated the government to be the answer to all social ills. Communists and Nazis were enemies because they were fighting over the same demographic. Many Nazi supporters were former communist supporters.
The history of the world is tyranny. America stood out for being for freedom but is slowly tending toward government control of our lives. Why is it the government's business if I wear a seatbelt, order food with transfats, or buy a gas-guzzling car? Government is here to protect us and our property from each other, not from what we wish to do to ourselves. Rush's point is that the policies of President Obama move us toward government control, as people from his party accuse the right of being the Nazis.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
The reason government needs to be a little more involved in our lives than they have been is because we are all brothers and sisters in this world and we can't get through this life successfully alone. There are people out there who just don't care. There are those who say to heck with everyone else, I'm a greedy jerk and I'm going to drive a Hummer whether you like it or not, whether it means my grandchildren won't be able to play outside due to the atmosphere or have clean drinking water or not. It's sad, but yes there are people in this world who don't give a darn about anyone else and it's those people we need to protect ourselves from. If everyone was considerate of everyone else, we wouldn't need to have more government involvement. As the population climbs, so does our effect on this world. As we humans grow in number, we tend to have less leg room to move around in this world and have to learn to be more considerate of one another and more patient and tolerant with each other and understand that we do effect one another, even if we don't think we do. It's just a sign of the times. It has nothing to do with this party or that party, it's simply the next intelligent step in our journey of life on Earth.
@samid, the problem with giving government more control to solve these problems is that historically, we know governments will say whatever it takes to get more power. Governments cannot be trusted with being in charge of our lives, because no one values me as much as I value myself.
There is a purpose for churches, charities, boycotts, and movements. We need a separation of powers. Churches can address the moral aspects of loving our neighbors and doing what's right without putting us in jail when we fail. Charities can help those who can't help themselves by accepting donations (not taxing it by force). Boycotts can be organized against businesses that are causing harm to the environment. Movements can be started to protect endangered species. Historically, all these non-government entities used to address social ills before government started to take over them. Government has its place, and it is not in being our religion or a mandatory charity. Government attempts to do what is impossible: good with other people's money. If you want to do good, do it with your money; don't seize mine.
The whole symbol comparison is what we call a segue. You know when you're doing a solo, like a talk show, sometimes you have to be your own straight-man. The seque isn't the point. It's just how you get to the point. Here's the point (quoting a news story quoting Rush (I didn't happen to hear the show)):
"Now, what are the similarities between the Democrat Party of today and the Nazi Party in Germany? Well, the Nazis were against big business — they hated big business . . . They were insanely, irrationally against pollution . . . They had a whole bunch of make-work projects to keep people working . . . They were for abortion and euthanasia of the undesirables, as we all know, and they were for cradle-to-grave nationalized healthcare."
The point is that the Nazis were a really scary ideology. So when the ideology espoused by those in power here starts to look too much like it, that's kind of scary ... well, isn't it? It's not really a stupid point to make. It's not really vicious, either ... it's natural to try to dramatize it a bit, to kind of bring it home.
There's a lot of "newspeak" going on in government to make the new healthcare plan seem harmless (there, I just did it too, used a word that implied I'm reminded of Big Brother in Orwell's 1984; well I am ... I'm also reminded of what went on in Ayn Rand's novel Atlas Shrugged .... both of these works were early warnings about the consequences of a seemingly benevolent government taking control of everything (because once they have control over everything else, then they want control over you). You should read these books (before they're banned)).
Everything I've seen here so far is kind of "fluff" ... let's talk about the real issue(s). The banking system, GM, and now the government's sights are set on healthcare. When all the major institutions in a country are owned by the government ... that's the way it is in socialism. Now we're not there quite yet, but I'd say there's enough going on here to make it a reasonable "mind-exercise" to think of this as a trend ... well what if it was a trend? And what if it just kept on going, one institution after another, the governement taking control of everything ... well? What's to stop it?
If you wait until it's all done, then it's too late.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
Interesting point you are making. Problem is that comparing Obamas policy ot Nazism isn't merely exaggerating, it is trying to make him 'evil', and not wanting to discuss things based on arguments.
Fact is, the US healthcare is one of the most expensive, and least effective systems in the world, and many companies have a huge interest in keeping it that way. They know they should be working more efficiently, but it would surely diminish their earnings. because they know this, and they know they cannot win this based on arguments, they play on false sentiments and mis-information. So, they call Obama a Socialist, a Nazi, a white-hater, and depict him as The Joker. It's an evil way of trying to win an argument, and sadly too many Americans are all too eager to play along.
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
Not always. They used them both ways.
The wings are not the wings of guardian angels. The caduceus is the staff of Hermes and the wings, when included, pertain to his speed as messenger of the gods.
Just a quick note... the "Swastika" symbol used by Eastern religions (both Buddhism and Hindiusm) is the mirror image of the Nazi symbol. They're not the same, though they look it to people who are unfamiliar with either.
Just a minor correction to your statement. Yes, the Nazis and Commies were enemies. The Nazis were Right-Wing Socialists and the Communists are Left Wing Socialists who both fought to become the rulers of Europe. The common thread being "SOCIALIST". Obama is also a Socialist, we just don't know if he's going the Facist way (government control of industry) or the Communist way (government ownership of industry). He's displayed a little of each.
most people that call him socialist, communist or even nazi have no idea what it means, there are are also people that use word racism too much to stifle debate.
Although Nazis and Communists were enemies, these ideologies are very close.
Nazism is national socialism, communism is a next stage after socialism with a goal of international Soviet republic over the whole world.
see Comintern: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comintern
People forget that Nazism was ultra left movement, not ultra right.
wow, those were some extreme simalaraties in those symbols, huh?Listen, I've been against Obama since the beginning, I believe he was only voted in because he was black. Oh, and by ''change we can believe in'', he only meant a black guy.As a personal nazi despiser,it wouldnt be to hard to believe that he was one......I hope obama sees this website, and reads this comment....bastard.
nominated you for the weekend edition of the AotD contest
Yes another quality answer, great stuff!
the symbol on the buddist chest IS NOT a swastika. a swastika is 2 intertwined S's which is short for Schutzstaffel. the symbol on the buddist is an intertwined "mirrored S" there is a huge difference.
Thanks! (wow, seems I've been nominated twice!)
Not really, swastika is defined for both the intertwined 'S', AND the mirrored one, even though the meanings are different. Buddism has always used both, although they nowadays mostly use the mirrored one because of the nazi association.