Is it better to live for eternity or for one human lifespan? Why? Discuss!
going on RIGHT NOW on Facebook, so I will acknowledge that here. To
see the original post by Dr. Rodney Howard-Browne, Pastor of the river church
at http://www.revival.com here is the snippet I originally saw on his Twitter
and http://www.twitter.com/rhowardbrowne, and the link to his Facebook:
"This life is only but a blip on the eternity screen - that being the case -
then what we do on the earth sets the... http://bit.ly/93Hu5U
I cannot use Facebook myself, as I value the freedom that Mahalo offers me
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use more meaningful examples and links and other resources, teach others about
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I hope that you enjoy discussing this topic. Easter has passed, and maybe
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PLEASE KEEP POSTING ON THIS TOPIC FOREVER AND A DAY TILL THE LAST DAY AVAILABLE....
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M$31 Answers
First, there appears to be the dichotomy between the "carpe diem" folks, and those who want to take the long view and live a directed life.
Second, there is the division between those who believe there is life after death (be it in heaven, through reincarnation, or what have you), as opposed to those who feel that once you die, that's it, end of story.
Third, there is the division between the religious and those who are not. The former may desire to follow G-d's will, and consider the thought of extending the human lifespan to eternity to be blasphemy. Indeed, in Genesis, G-d expressly forbids Adam and Eve from eating of the fruits of the tree of life and the tree of knowledge, and once they eat of the latter, exiles them from the Garden of Eden to prevent their becoming immortal, at which point they would be godlike themselves. Those who are not religious feel this entire line of reasoning is irrelevant as they either do not believe in any god, or feel that anything that we can do must be allowed by G-d, else it would be impossible to do.
Next, we an divide opinions between those who so love life that they cannot possibly entertain ever wanting it to end, and those who feel that to live is to suffer, and long to be allowed to move on to what they hope will be either a better place, or else eternal rest (possibly oblivion).
Another argument would be one of boredom vs. creativity and curiosity. Some feel that eternal life would lead to boredom everlasting, while others feel they and the rest of humanity are so creative that they cannot wait to see what will be the next thing to come down the pike.
A serious consideration is one of the ability of our environment to support immortal beings. Indeed, if we maintain a positive population growth, we will ultimately exhaust the capability of the planet to support life. With all humans immortal, the only means to prevent a population explosion would be to have no more children, a fate that many would consider quite literally worse than death.
We can probably continue along this path and find many ways to divide opinions on this matter, but I think the above are enough to get us started on the debate, as they already cover a fair amount of ground and even have some overlaps between them.
So, the case I would make for limiting our lives to one (possibly somewhat longer) human lifespan boils down to the following:
- Eternal life would result in feeling we have all the time in the world so we'd get nothing done.
- Eternal life would become too boring to bear.
- For the religiously-inclined, eternal life is forbidden by G-d (according to Genesis).
- For the religiously-inclined who believe in heaven, eternal life on Earth is giving up on heaven.
- Eternal beings would overwhelm the environment unless we have no more children, which is against the natural order of life.
The case for striving for eternal life could be boiled down to the following:
- Eternal life would provide an endless opportunity to do good.
- Eternal life would always be interesting as humans are endlessly creative.
- Even if there is a god, if we can become immortal, it must mean He did not forbid it, Genesis notwithstanding.
- Eternal earthly existence could allow us the opportunity to create a heaven on Earth.
- Perhaps becoming immortal would also include other aspects of change such as ascension to a higher form of existence (e.g. as beings made of energy, as self-aware programs running on ever-evolving hardware, or any of several other options explored in the science fiction literature). As such, this may actually make things easier on the environment. If not, we can also expect at some point to expand beyond this one planet.
- Eternal life would make possible exploration of far stars through e.g. relativistic space travel, with or without cryogenic sleep.
Personally, I tend more toward the latter viewpoint. In my opinion carpe diem and living a directed life are not mutually exclusive. One can think of the two as the tactical vs the strategic. In war both are needed. One uses directed living (aka strategy) to determine long-term goals, aspirations, dreams, etc. Then, one seizes the day every day to wring the most enjoyment and fulfillment from whatever life hands you that day (aka tactical living if you will), as you guide your overall direction to align with your strategic goals.
Another way to think about the debate which I feel supports my view is the following. Rather than consider the matter from a global G-d's eye view, think of it from the perspective of the human living his/her life. Would you desire to end your life today? How about tomorrow? For most sane people (at least those living a relatively free and prosperous life), the answers to those questions would be no, and no. Ok, then let's move on to the next inescapable question - why would you expect those answers to change as another day goes by, and another, and another? Would there ever arrive a point where you would say "Enough! I want to die today!"? I assert that the logical answer is that as long as we can continue living a healthy life without extreme suffering, it is our nature to wish to continue to exist without limit.
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M$You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
It is the knowing that we will die one day that allows us to really live each day. The unknown date of our death adds fuel to the desire to live and not "just live" but to excel at dreaming and chasing dreams.
With eternal life and without certain death there would be no real motive to dream or chase dreams because we would know that there would always be time to have or chase that dream later on in this eternal life.
Pressure to create the best life possible in the limited time we have here is what life is about. One could say the secret to life is death because it is death that is the unknown deadline that creates the desire to really live.
We need this deadline to create our dreams and a life without dreams.. well .. that life might as well not be lived.. because it is not.
Without death there is no motive to "seize the day".
I agree so perfectly I had no reason to answer. Bravo.
I added a longer answer below but I wanted to add a contrasting comment here too.
"With eternal life and without certain death there would be no real motive to dream or chase dreams because we would know that there would always be time to have or chase that dream later on in this eternal life." - @buddawiggi
I get the same sense of urgency and drive to pursue my dreams even with my choice to participate in what eternal life offers. Why? Because as I mentioned below, every day is the longest I've ever been alive.
If I had the foreknowledge that I'd be alive tomorrow why would I stop living for today? Also if I didn't believe in something available after I die, wouldn't some people just give up and accomplish nothing because of the futility of it all?
I think how I live and how you live is a personal choice no matter how many days we attribute to our existence. Death is no more a deterrent for laziness than prison is against speeding.
I'll still be me tomorrow or after a thousand tomorrows and today will still be today a million years later. I'll never get bored or tired of learning, trying, experiencing and anyone who thinks the universe is so limited that even after a million years of exploring there still won't be an eternity of things to do is extremely shortsighted in my opinion. :)
I look forward to the Bonus Round but maybe that's just me.
What I say is this: Jesus became fully human, but did he live for just one human lifespan? No. He sacrificed his own human life for all of our mortal lives to we could live for eternity. Yes, he was also fully God (sorry, not sure what other religions believe, but this is what I grew up learning) so it was much easier for him to think more "eternally" than it is for us. But I think this says something about how we should live our lives. Everything that faith is based on tells us to look forward towards the afterlife and heaven. We are told that when people die, they go to a better place. We are told that if we do good works, it will secure a place for us in heaven (not sure if I believe this one). But I guess my thought is that it is so much better to live for where we want to go. If you want to make excuses and make mistakes and live dangerously, I'd say go for the Carpe Diem. If you want to have a good life here on Earth and make it the best for yourself and your family, then live for a lifespan. If you want to be truly faithful and spiritual, live for eternity, meaning, always have God in your mind and heart, and try to make your choices based on your faith in him.
I don't want it to sound like a contest. Like whoever lives their life more aimed towards the afterlife by doing good deeds will make it into heaven. It's more about a personal journey. There is not one right way to be faithful. There is not one right way to "make it into heaven." Live your life how you want to, but be aware of your choices.
I hope this has made sense! This is the first religious-based question I've answered on here, or anywhere else for that matter, so I may be a little rusty :). Great question!
Opinion, faith.
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M$"PLEASE KEEP POSTING ON THIS TOPIC FOREVER AND A DAY TILL THE LAST DAY AVAILABLE.... "
Forever and a day is like my 5-year old son asking me the next number after infinity.
According to him, it's "infinity plus one." But he's in kindergarten, so I let it slide.
Now, to answer your question, "one human lifetime." I was a perfectly happy, healthy college kid in 1993 when I had a seizure at the age of 22. I was rushed to a hospital, diagnosed with a potentially fatal condition, and my parents pulled me from school and had me evaluated at two huge university hospitals on the east coast. Nothing could be one--I'd have a stroke someday, but I was told to go live my life.
I should mention I'd just met my girlfriend six weeks earlier. Not the way I'd intended for her to meet my parents, who drove three hours after one of my friends called them.
I got back to school and felt lousy--there were days I didn't move out of bed. I took an "incomplete" in all of my classes and graduated that summer. I worked the same summer job I had for three prior summers, just with no driving, no lifting and more breaks. Then I started a career in hospitality. Seven years later, in 2000 I moved halfway across the country to follow that girlfriend to her hometown, and we got married in 2001. Our honeymoon was a cruise through Europe. I went to Hong Kong and China on business for 10 days in 2002. I did 2 TV commercials in 2002. Our son was born in 2004.
Two weeks before his first birthday, at the end of June, 2005, I woke up to get him one morning and my left leg fell out from under me. It was 12 years in the making--no question what it was. I had just had a massive stroke. I spent 2 weeks in an Intensive Care Unit and began what would become full summer of outpatient rehabilitation--walking and talking. I had to leave my job as a sales manager and member of the purchasing team for a furniture store.
I had Neurosurgery that Fall. That was #1 of 7, spaced out over 2006 into early 2007. I had another massive bleed in early 2006. You know you've been in an ICU too many times when a nurse walks in and says "Hey, man, I saw your name on the board. How's your kid?"
Everything's cool until May 2008...I had another seizure. A month later, another Then a month later, another.
And a stroke in Nov. 2008. In February, 2009, I began doing volunteer Advocacy for the Disabled, and I've gotten noticed by politicians, appointed officials, corporate people from The Governor's Office to Capitol Hill. I've made change--real change I can see--and I'm happy I could.
And another in May 2009. By this ti9me I'm divorced. And for the first time, I'm an inpatient at a rehabilitation hospital where I was the healthiest one around--I just could hardly move my left hand. (Yes, this was all typed with my right hand.)
My Occupational Therapy office had a sign that said something along the likes of "When you get to the end of the road, you don't want to arrive in a perfectly clean and pressed outfit. You want to get there with windblown hair, holding a glass of wine in your hand and chocolate in the other, screaming 'WOO-HOO, WHAT A RIDE!'"
ON THE OTHER HAND, my voice will live forever-it's at archive.org, and they don't appear to be going anywhere any time soon.
Listen at http://garyallen.mp3-archives.com
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M$The fact is, our physical bodies are not immortal, for whatever reason. If you choose to believe it's because of original sin, and that we are still "paying" for what Adam and Eve did, then that makes your God pretty unforgiving, doesn't it? I mean, it's been a long, long, LONG time and we're still paying the price for THEIR crimes against God? Not such a nice God after all, maybe, and maybe Jesus doesn't have so much power, since he doesn't seem to be able to change that. You'd think he'd want to, wouldn't you?
I just want whatever energy there is in my body to be recycled into another living thing. I don't want to live in this body forever, or go to "heaven". I want to be reused until there is no more earth, then I want to be recycled back into the universal energy. I remember reading that in one obscure religion (can't remember which), they believe that new stars are formed from the souls of the righteous, which I guess float around in space until there are enough of them to make a bright star. Sounds nice, to be recycled as a star. I'd like that.
Genesis3:19b " for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return."
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M$
I'm not a Christian, so I don't believe in heaven or hell. I actually think that people who believe that some invisible man in the sky controls their destiny is pretty sad. My idea of "God" is HUGE, because I think everything and everyone is part of "God". I'm a pantheist. Look it up, if you are interested in opening your mind to new ideas. If not, then go ahead and believe in what you believe in, but I know about Christianity, having lived it for most of my life. What do you know about other spiritual paths? Until you have learned as much as you can about all spiritual paths, you are not fit to judge my beliefs.
Your idea of Heaven is pretty sad.
I can see that you're trying to make logical sense of it, but your foundation is weak.
What i mean is, your idea of God is way too small.
How can a God that can create an infinite universe, make a Heaven so small?
You're logic is based on the fact that God only created the earth, and all the people and animals on it would make Heaven way too crowded.
Also, you failed to take note that not everyone will go to Heaven. Even if you marry 3 times and manage to go to Heaven, what're the chances that all 3 of your wives will be there?
And finally, the purpose of Heaven isn't a big reunion party. Jesus addresses this very issue here: Matthew 22:23-32
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+22&version=NIV
I try my best to live my life, as if each is my last to a certain extent. I do make future plans and goals. However, I let the day take care of itself and treat each day as one step closer to my eternal life. Doing the best I can to set examples and get closer to God. I live this this life now on earth, for the one that is to follow, the eternal life. All I feel I can do with this life on earth is leave behind examples for others, because once it is over for me, nothing about my life here now will be important... except to the people left here who loved me. It's the only thing I can give them that will outlive myself.
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M$
Although the possibilities for learning new things and exploring seem to be endless, they are in fact limited, what will you do then? Wait for new technology so you can garnish it? I'd say making new theories is also a possibility, but most people do not have the passion/patience to do this... You would run out of things to do.
Also, many people come to the conclusion the earth isn't all that great in their "short" lifespans (compared to eternity or more realistically to the time the universe has existed in). What possible other reasoning could one develop during their extended lifetime? Remember, you will be what you are today, the same person, maybe with a different mentality and perspective and a lot more knowledge, but knowledge doesn't equal your given intelligence, intelligence is but a tool to enhance your insight on theories and knowledge, to absorb knowledge more easily if you wil; while other beings (given the hypothesis they are not immortal) will develop, reproduce and evolve. Any flaw you have in the future that would normally have caused death won't matter, you will have those flaws; you'll eventually be alienated from society since everyone will be different (even more alienated than some feel today, on a physiological level), you'll be stuck in your outdated version of the human body, which could still be under the effect of aging, think about it.
The possibilities are endless and since our universe endless, everything is possible, I don't think I could elaborate any further without drawing this on for too long.
Eternal life in the figurative tense of the word, your genes would never die out in the first example (given the presumption you will not become infertile over the years, if not the same applies to what's coming next).
In this example however, there is no guarantee your genes will be passed on indefinitely and chances are the human race will be on the verge of extinction in the future, which make the chance for YOUR genes to still be in "use" almost nihil. In case of extinction, well, the answer is obvious... Time won't end just because there are no humans to perceive it, in an endless universe there are endless possibilities as stated before, which means there are probably other organisms with an advanced enough brain to have their own concept of time (disregarding earthly "animals" here for a while, as I can't prove they have an active perception of time).
There's also the possibility you'll accomplish something great for which you shall be remembered (again, there is no guarantee that "data" wouldn't be lost someday before human extinction, in a post-apocalyptic setting perhaps) for an extended period of time, for the period where in humanity will exist in to be more precise. Even this is not "eternity"...if the human race manages to stay alive the earth will still perish, if the humans managed to colonize other planets, who is to determine whether the "earth" records will be remembered? More specifically, YOUR records, what makes YOU exceptional.
Although this setting is possible, it's highly unlikely; I'm just trying to write my extensive thoughts down.
Living for an eternity, in the litteral sense of the word, wouldn't seem enjoyable to me in the long run. (paragraph 1, 2)
Living for an eternity, in the figurative sense of the word, is nearly impossible and is not something to actively strive for. This doesn't mean I'm advising people to not do great things, I'm just illustrating everything should be looked at from a different perspective. The actions which you consider as "great", could not be considered great for the interest of human kind or for the perception of greatness of the human kind! (paragraph 3)
I tried to make it as short as possible, I hope it was interesting to read for those who got to this part.
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M$For me only having one lifetime means that I have the drive necessary to achieve my potential, whatever that may be. You have a finite period to achieve your goals and are therefore willing to put in the necessary work to achieve them.
Furthermore I believe that the knowledge that you don't live forever makes you more aware of the potential problems that may lie ahead and you are therefore more willing to make a different in the here and now. A case in point is the tens of thousands of people that run the London marathon each year to raise millions for charities - would these people be so driven to help others if there wasn't some small part of them that knew it could be them one day?
Saying all of this though I'm merely referring to human life on Earth - whether you love for eternity once you depart the Earth is surely another question, and one which I believe should be left to the beliefs of the individual.
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M$
What is it that gives life importance?
If you lived forever, what would you have to live for? In my opinion, the value of a life is not measured on the physical wealth you have accumulated or how much pleasure you have experienced. Yes, life must be enjoyable! But, when you are in your last moments and you look back, can you say to yourself, "That was a life worth living." What have you left behind for the next generation? What is your legacy?
If you lived an eternity, would you be more motivated to the Good? Or would we have a society living in perpetual procrastination. "Come on mom, I'll get my degree next millenium!"
Living an eternity would negate the sense of urgency and desire to achieve, so prevelent in a single lifespan.
Plus, if nobody died, we would definitely have a real estate problem. Imagine the exponential growth of a population that never died naturally!
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M$
However, (without checking the links) I suspect the question actually has more to do with heaven than a "lifespan" spent on earth. No-one -- and I repeat, no-one -- has any idea what happens when we die. The obvious answer is that nothing happens (that would seem to be the "fact" offered by our knowledge of dead bodies) and, frankly, that's the way I lean. However, I understand that a lot of people HOPE (without any knowledge) that there is some place or some dimension that allows each individual to "survive" into an everlasting future.
To me, hoping for heaven is the same as buying a lottery ticket and hoping to win. However, all the evidence we have suggests that the lottery ticket is actually the better bet because we KNOW there is at least one winner.
long life
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M$
Since your comment about Jesus is based on a reference in the Bible (it's unlikely we'd know anything about Jesus without it) you "might" find it interesting that other notable Bible characters did ascend without experiencing death first. So tying your sources together it's fair to say that "someone" has lived beyond a human lifespan. And if one continues to use that source for information there is also knowledge to be gained about what happens when we die, the process of choosing if Heaven is something a person wants to participate in, etc.
But NOT using the Bible as a source for information (assuming your reference was to make a point, not actually a source), you're spot on. The only other thing I'd add is that my take on what happens (using the Bible as my source) is more in line with what is actually written there, not what most people say is there. So I have Faith in my knowledge, Hope I reserve for other things.
Have you ever grown bored of doing something?? Even something you really really really love will eventually grow boring if you keep doing it.
With eternal life, you could do everything you ever loved to do... and do it over and over and over and over... until you were absolutely sick of doing it... and you would still have eternity to go.
You could do everything you ever imagined. Learn every skill possible. Master any art. Learn things you never imagined and learn and master them... and you would still have eternity to go.
You could then do the things you do not like doing. And you could do those things over and over until you completely mastered them. And you could do them each a thousand times over. And you would still have eternity to go.
You could read and hand translate every book ever into every language ever created. Then do it again, but writing every word backwards.
You could read every phone book ever made.
You could count every grain of sand on every beach on every planet in every galaxy... a thousand times...
And you would still have eternity to go.
In a very short time you would learn that the only thing you really want to be able to do is to die. And you would still have eternity to go.
I personally could not imagine a hell worse than eternal life.
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M$
1. The human life (even if it is 500 years in average) is too short (yes, I repeat, too short) to witness, to feel, to see, to enjoy and to gather knowledge about every nook and corner of this beautiful creation of God, that we know by the name of Earth. So, with an eternal life, we can just travel and travel infinitely and praise the incomparable creations of Almighty.
2. This human life is too short to know the results of many experiments which take more than one human lifespan to complete. For example, we send a spacecraft to another galaxy that is millions of light years away. In that case, it may take thousands of years on Earth to receive back its signals. What a pity? The person who initiates such experiment will never be able to know its results. Another example is the experiments for finding cure of most incurable diseases, re-generation of limbs, cloning etc. take unimaginably long time to show results. There are many more similar experiments meant for the benefit of mankind and this earth take so long time that the good people who start them never see their outcome. So, having an eternal life would certainly benefit management of such experiments.
3. Just imagine if all the good and kind people could live eternally, this Earth would have been a heaven to live in. Just imagine if Jesus himself survived and we could really see him and this human civilization could benefit from his presence; then perhaps this world would have been a far-far better place.
4. When everybody could live forever, then you could always see your family and your loved ones beside you, through eternity. Isn't it something you always wanted, that you never part from your loved ones?
5. If I were to live eternally, I could protest with all my might against injustice, inequality and all odds, without having to worry that I would die or get killed in the process.
6. Human could travel to distant galaxies in search of new inhabitable places without sending a robotic spacecraft.
7. At the time of death, we need not repent for having not done or accomplishing something. We will have all the time to do our duties to everybody to whom we owe.
8. The more time we have, the more time we can donate towards service of mankind and towards serving God.
9. When nobody dies, then there will be no use of weapons either. So, those who are stacking them now, will have no choice but to dump them in garbage. Their very purpose of killing human beings will not be solved.
10. One of the ultimate goals of science and spirituality will be achieved, simultaneously.
Opinions may differ although, and they are welcome to differ.
Thanks
Personal Opinion
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M$You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
Nope. Life is only boring if you let it be. I have fought in wars, taught softball and baseballl on travel teams, played football, hockey, basketball, bowled, watched my daughters be all state in high school and play in college., volunteered for different projectgs, attended college, watched our country move away from Democracy and toward Socialism, watched my daughter accept her degree from the Uinv of Michigan in science (Chemistry), watched as my younger daughter goes through paramedic training with her goal to be a firefighter and eventuallymed school, built web sites, watched as people who have never experienced certain things think they are experts on a subject. I have watched as people no longer care about life (abortions and the early release of killers who then kill again), as liberals clamor to make immoral issues legal to satisfy their lack of will power. Have seen our schools crumble as God has been taken from them and the teaching of right and wrong has disappeared with it. I would like to be here to see the next revolution in the USA, which is coming. Then the great discoveries of the universe and the exploratins of our own planet. How long before there is a cure for all diseases, and how long before the next religious confrontation? I would like to be here when people wake up and realize that morailty is an issue that affects us all. I would like to see the next ballgame, and the next and the next. I could go on and on, but one lifetime is certainly not enough id you open your mind to all the possibilities in even our limited environment. One statement I heard from a friend was "I do not believe in God, but something made it easier on my family when my mother was dying. Something prepared us." Hmmm, wonder what that was? I have had elderly people tell me they could see someon sittin gon the end of their bed when they were dying. Anyway, there is way tooooooo much to learn to not want to live forever. Everyday I wake up and thank God for the wonderful world we live in. Now if only the people could see that also.
I was a pretty depressed kid, and struggled with depression through college, and so i never really grasped the concept that living forever would be a good thing. As i became a Christian, and grew in my walk with Christ, I find myself longing for the after-life, simply because life on earth is so hard.
An eternity of pure bliss with my creator is very appealing.
An eternity on earth, with all these pains and emotions. And worse yet boredom. I don't think i could handle. I don't want to handle.
Boredom, I believe, is the key to perverseness. People turn to perverse forms of entertainment becomes they have become bored with the traditional (i used this word loosely) way of doing things.
Genesis says that we were created in God's image. I think that means we were created for eternity, but because Adam and Eve gained knowledge of good and evil (I believe that the knowledge of evil is the key point, and evil is equivalent to selfishness) we have strayed away from God's image. We were created with a bit of eternity inside all of us (some call it the soul), but we live selfishly, as if this Earth is all we have. We limit ourselves. We spend so much time planning for tomorrow and regretting the mistakes of yesterday, we fail to celebrate the gift of today.
I believe in eternity. Here's a little something Apostle Paul said.
Philippians 3:18-20 (NIV)
"18For, as I have often told you before and now say again even with tears, many live as enemies of the cross of Christ. 19Their destiny is destruction, their god is their stomach, and their glory is in their shame. Their mind is on earthly things. 20But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ,"
I believe in Eternity. We should all believe in Eternity. Whether it be an Eternity of Emptiness (there is no God), or an Eternity of Bliss (There is a God, that you are willing to worship). So whether you live for yourself, or for something greater for yourself. Which is wiser?
Spending the few days you have here (for they are few compared to all of recorded history) indulging your impulses and desires until you've become bored with the pure and simple.
Or spending your days struggling to make your possible future better, so that you can maybe enjoy it. assuming everything goes according to plan, and nothing out of your control happens. When in reality, everything is out of your control.
Or spending your days regretting some past decision, or mourning a loss that will never return. Thus wasting away your existence on things that, once again, you cannot control.
Or appreciating the miracles of today.
I for one would like to spend my days learning more about the one who created me, the world He created, and applying what I've learned about Him.
For what good is it to learn something and not apply it?
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Living a life of eternity with my Creator would be the ultimate goal that I want to achieve rather than one human lifespan. A human lifespan I believe is a training ground for me to be able to know God better, to enjoy the life that He has given me, to appreciate His goodness, to experience His love through my family and the people I met and get connected with.
He gave me this human life for He wants me to feel and experience the depth of His love for me. He wants to prepare me for a life of eternity in Heaven where there is no pain and suffering.
These are the reason why I chose to live in eternity instead of a life span on earth. This would be naive to some but this is the wisdom that the Holy Spirit has given me. Albeit it is difficult because living a life now is full of hardships, temptation, consumerism, which sometimes makes it hard for me to focus on what matters most that sometimes I spend 90% of my time doing things that are mundane and earthly but I am doing my best to never lose focus, to be able to see God in every person I see and meet and to offer to God all the things I do. That everything I have done and accomplished will be for His glory. I know I have made a choice and that is to live in eternity with God my creator, my savior, my life.
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Luke 12:33. "Sell your possessions and give to charity; make yourselves purses which do not wear out, an unfailing treasure in heaven, where no thief comes near, nor moth destroys."
Mt. 19:20ff. The young man said to Him, "All these commands I have kept; what am I still lacking?" Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me."
my own brief answer
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M$
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M$
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M$
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This question encouraged me to think outside the box and also consider how I would answer if, hypothetically, the concept of a higher power was foreign or nonexistent. In this case, I would have to say that I would choose one human life. The old saying about 'everything in moderation' has held truth in most of my life experiences thus far, and after accomplishing my goals I would wish to leave my mark and allow the next generation to take mine over.
Even as a religious person, I have a fear of the unknown. Be it Heaven or Hell, the inability to find any kind of legitimate answers or information about it is terrifying. It is beyond human comprehension, making it useless to even question. This is not to say that I would rather not believe; however, this makes it clear to me that if I knew nothing about religion I would fear what it meant to live forever.
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body: one lifespan
soul: eternity
Cheers!
faith
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Just random thoughts from an insomniac.
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M$I'm not cynical, I'm experienced. I have lived long enough to recognize the risk of "Eternal Life".
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But I would also like to mention that I do not like to read too much in a question. You are so polite to mention that you have collected the question from…….(source & a lot of discussion).
You have also mentioned that “I cannot use Facebook myself, as I value the freedom that Mahalo offers me in remaining relatively anonymous and hopefully not that biased as well”. – I think the authority of Mahalo will not mind if you use Facebook. Please do not afraid so much as you are a religious person (I like all the religious persons), religious persons afraid only the God.
You have also mentioned that “Easter has passed, and maybe
no one wants to think about spirituality for another year” – Its not true. Because most people would be interested to answer any question with a good tip. If the tips of your question is less, you will get one or two responses (if you ask 10 questions on ester providing $ 4.00 for each question, you will get 20 to 40 answers, whereas for this question (tips value $ 40), you will not exceed the mentioned figure.
Now the main question: “Is It Better To Live For ETERNITY Or For ONE HUMAN LIFESPAN?”
It is better to live for one human lifespan, just as the Creator has decreed. The Creator has appointed a term for every soul – some 1 year, some 10 years, some 50 years or more – it is absolutely the discretion of Almighty God Who has created us. So, it is better the way it is occurring naturally. If we had eternal life in this world, then man would have considered himself to be a creator, like the Almighty. For example, Washington, the founder of the USA, during his tenure, stipulated a maximum of two terms for President, for if anyone remains in power for more than 10 years or 2 terms, they may start thinking of themselves as God. Therefore, I think it is better to live for one human lifespan in this world, rather than for eternity.
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M$This is what I believe.
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I remember my Dad sitting on the front porch, about a week before he passed away from lung cancer. I sat next to him and neither of us spoke. It was the most serene moment in my life. I was watching him look at the trees slightly blowing, the birds above and I know he was listening to the calmness in the earth. He had a slight smile on his face. The moment seemed to last forever and is embedded within me. I will never forget it. Tears began rolling down his cheek. That was a huge "light bulb" moment day for me. I live every day as my Dad did, with no regrets. I try to never let the little things bother me. I have passed this to my kids, as well. I like to think my husband has learned from my attitude on life as well.
My Dad was the perfect human being while on earth and could not possibly have any regrets. He lived everyday like it was his last, with laughter smiles and provided an amazing foundation for us kids.
I do believe one life span is enough for us all. I am not certain how we would all act knowing we would be here for ever. Life would not be as much as a gift.
Life experience
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I'm only in my early 30s and let me tell you boredom is taking it's toll on me. Food is a great example of this. I'm sick of eating. I'm tired of it. How many hot dogs have I eaten in my life? How much rice? How much broccoli?? I'm so freakin sick of eating I wish I could just eat nutrient paste once a day and it would take 3 minutes. My Father used to say this and I never understood because I do love different foods and always have. I've just eaten EVERYTHING on Earth pretty much and I'm just plain sick of it. Imagine an eternity filled with our limited amount of foods. I'd probably wish death upon myself at about 150 after eating my 5000th pizza.
The religious believe we live forever anyway. We go to a magical happy place with our family and live with them forever. I don't know about you but I've lived around my family for long enough thank you. Eternity with them would be insufferable. Sure I love my wife and kids but ETERNITY?? Come on!!
Heaven better have some kickass multiplayer video games and all dogs better not go to heaven either. Imagine all the poop! Maybe that's why angels fly?
Imagine how fat you could become if you could live for eternity but never exercised haha! It would be a depressing world full of know it all Jabba the Hutts. Not a pleasant vision to me.
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If anyone feels they would be bored with eternal life, then they just do not know how to live. Life is never boring, only people are. Apparently there are a lot of people who do not know how to live and love and learn. It would take a million life times and more to lern everything. Time to stop wasting your lives and time to take a look at this awesome world and universe we live. Life never ends, it just undergoes change. Nothing is wasted in the universe.
Think about this: If you were asked to name the date that you would choose to die, what date would that be? Would it be three days from now? No, my grandchild is graduating from high school next month. Would it be three years from now? No, I want to retire and live the life I have been waiting all my life to live. The point is, most people don't want to die. Even those with health problems, financial problems, family problems, still want to live....often with the hope that the next day will bring the relief they were looking forward to. Granted, there are some who suffer greatly who would be willing to set a date of death. But the Bible tells us that God 'has put eternity into their hearts'(1). That is why it is so difficult to set a date of death for ourselves. Besides, if anyone else is like me, there is not enough time in an average human lifespan to do all the things I want to do, see all the places I would like to see(2). And even the activities I enjoyed as a youth are getting farther and farther out of reach as I age.
What if we could spend eternity as God intended us to spend it....on a beautiful earth, no wickedness, no health problems, no prejudice, no hatred, no death....just doing meaningful work, enjoying pleasant company, enjoying excellent health, and not having to worry about a loved one leaving us in death(3). All of these things we would have had if Adam and Eve had not disobeyed God's command to abstain from eating from only one tree in the Garden(4).
So I will strive to live my best life in the conditions that surround me now so that I can have the best life in the conditions that are soon to come.
Bible
(1)Eccl 3:10;
(2) Ps 145:16;
(3)Rev 21:3,4
(4)Gen 2:16,17
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M$My answer is based on the Bible's information on eternal life, heaven, death, etc. What is actually written, not what most people SAY is there. So with that in mind I can say that for ME, choosing eternal life is better.
I met someone that knew the same things I did and their choice was only their normal lifespan. While the thought was foreign to me, I was able to appreciate the fact that they had the right to choose just like I did. Even if it was a different choice, it made my choice all the more precious.
Unlike some of the comments here, it is important that I seize the day even with the knowledge of heaven and eternal life. Because it's not a destination for everyone, it's a choice and it requires forethought and effort. It's not an accident nor does it involve an auto-enrollment plan. So how I choose to live each day is important. Living each moment like it's my last and my first is the building block to eternal joy and happiness for me.
For all my years on this Earth, every day is the longest I've ever been alive. To me this is eternity until it's not. Even though I'm confident I'll experience death first, my faith in what is possible and my desire to be a part of it is directly in line with what I know and believe. So unlike some, the chance to continue beyond a normal human lifespan is very appealing and fills me with hope that what I can't accomplish in a single lifetime I'll still have a chance to pursue in Heaven and beyond.
I'm looking forward to eternal life. But I don't take it for granted either. I'm also looking forward to spending eternity with my wife. Even if marriages aren't important there anymore, our connection here has been vital to my growth and happiness so to me it's worth preserving in Heaven too. It's symbolism of Christ's relationship with the Church is not lost on me either. Those who have a chance to experience it here first will have just that much more to be thankful for in Heaven.
And as I mentioned in other comments on this page, boredom will never be an issue for me. The universe is as unlimited as my mind is. I'll never be bored because there'll never be an end to new things or my ability to create and interact with them.
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Excellent answer, Opher.
@opher creativity is not endless tho when you are talking about a truly endless period of time like eternity.
Given an eternal amount of time, you could literally combine every single atom in the universe in every possible combination of ways. You could literally do everything possible to do and everything creatively possible and even everything non-creatively possible.
You could learn how to create universes. Create one new universe for each atom in our universe exploring every possible combination of possible variations in any conceivable or inconceivable physical parameters.
And after you have combined all the atoms in the universe in all possible ways you would still have an eternity ahead of you.
And you could do all the above over and over so many times that you grow bored of all the things you have done.
And after you have done everything imaginable and everything possible and impossible and grown bored over and over you would still have an eternity ahead of you to be bored in.
I have to draw attention to one comment you made:
- Eternal life would always be interesting as humans are endlessly creative.
Eternal life would necessarily be eternally boring...
(see other post)
It took me four and a half hours to look over your answers and put up a draft answer before the answer deadline, and I just made it before I lost control of the question completely! And you can all see that my answer is completely inadequate, not just because I wanted to keep editing what I had already written, but you can see that
I was just able in that time to cover one aspect of the question and a bit of it at that. At the same time, there are people out there that fascinate and confound and stretch my thinking with their discussion, even with doctorate degrees in their areas, that have studied these issues and share their insights freely online like these 2 pastors with doctorates http://bit.ly/aBsCbs and http://www.facebook.com/pages/Richard-Roberts-Oral-Roberts-Ministry/75171531959 and others in links found from my other questions in my member page in various media http://www.mahalo.com/member/valz click on questions. So, who am I to even ask any of these spiritual questions? I haven't got this knowledge, others do, and I will not be able to catch up to their years of study and experience and insight on these issues. Not sure if I will continue with these types of questions or not - there is so much room for others to step in who actually know something!
That being said I have another tiny aspect that I have been chewing on. Living your life in an eternal way, to continue the lifetime accomplishments and generational heritage of your particular family tree and also to contribute to human civilization by extending the contribution your family tree makes to the world by adding new accomplishments that will stand long after you have left the Earth. This could be in various ways such as creating a legacy in solving world problems, teaching and mentoring the next generation of contibutors to the world, giving of yourself to make the current and future world a better place, contributing to the world knowledge bank in academic study or even sharing on Mahalo in a quality way for posterity for your children, grandchildren and those to follow, raising a well-prepared next generation of much needed problem-solvers, building institutions that can now and will help humanity in the future, helping erase the mistakes that past generations have made in their short-sighted stewardship of the Earth such as saving endangered species and if we are lucky the planet itself, and I could go on for days on what your vision of eternity-based living may be, and what role you could contribute to it depending on your skills, abilities and talents. Just so you know, I would like to tip everyone for contributing to honor all your efforts as I did in some of my past questions where I felt the collective synergy of knowledge and wisdom created was very cool, but I have to leave something for the 4 remaining questions that I have to tip for in the next few days. I am also winding down my affairs in questions now - I have to get back to school and no further time for fun projects at this time - also I have pages that I manage that are long overdue for a look see and I do intend to continue with my pagework as I so enjoy that. I hope you all enjoyed the ride and continue in your own personal journeys to enlightenment in this lifetime and beyond for those who choose that. Isn't Mahalo a cool place to be? Glad to meet you all online! Bye for now!
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@stephenfroberts, I respectfully disagree with you. Creativity is endless. To say otherwise is in my opinion to have lost faith in the human spirit.
YIKES!!! I was thinking about what to say for so long, I picked the winner right down to the wire in the last few minutes - it won't even let me edit the answer - WHEW!!! so glad I made it, stressful being a question asker when you don't know the answers and have to look every single word up somewhere else.....hope y'all enjoyed the process - I had a blast - this was such fun, best use of my Mahalo dollars I could think of!!! Take care all and best of luck in your pursuit of eternity!
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@stephenfroberts, your fallacy is that you are using a limited perspective. The number of particles in the universe is not finite. New particles are being created and destroyed all the time. With an eternity to learn, grow wise, and create ever more intricate and intriguing ways of combining things, there is no limit to what can be done.
In any case, I understand your point, and I simply disagree with it. In addition, the question does not necessarily preclude the possibility of voluntarily ending your existence if your well of personal creativity ever does run dry.
Another option, you can voluntarily manipulate your identity, your memory, etc. and start fresh at any point. We are after all assuming you've had an extremely long time to learn all there is to know about the human body and spirit.
The only possible limit I do see is the eventual heat-death of the universe, at which point no further life would be possible, unless we learn how to reverse entropy on a universal scale. Of course if this does occur, the problem of eternal boredom is resolved along with it.
Regardless, you should feel free to maintain your opinion. This is after all an open-ended question and nobody's opinion is intrinsically more correct than anyone else's.