If they were around today, which of our "Founding Fathers" would be under investigation for questionable morals and/or ethics?
A list of the Founding Fathers of the United States
http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution_founding_fathers.html
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M$5 Answers
So, having lived a long time in Massachusetts, I took a closer look at the four Founding Fathers (using your definition) from that state. Here are these four.
Elbridge Gerry. He had a clear conflict of interest when he served on the congressional board that set prices paid for supplies by the Continental Congress while being one of the merchants selling the supplies himself. He engaged in privateering, which amounted to being a pirate with a license of sorts. Politically, he is also remembered for giving us the word "gerrymander" for his convoluted, partisan redistricting as governor.
Nathaniel Gorham. He was another privateer. He also was a land speculator which led to his bankrupcy.
Caleb Strong. During the War of 1812, as Governor of Massachusetts he not only refused to cooperate with the Federal government, but there is some evidence he attempted to secretly negotiate a separate peace with Britain ceding part of Maine. This would probably be considered treason if true.
Rufus King. King seems to have been relatively upstanding, but he would have been investigated for his close friendship with Chrisopher Gore, a speculator in government securities who became the richest lawyer in Massachusetts.
I'll be interested to see if anyone comes up with a Founding Father who would not rate an ethics investigation.
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M$
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M$
They were men of action, passion, and conviction. They were men of intellect, heart and honor. The Boston Tea Party was an illegal act of aggression against a tyrant bent on subjugating them. Not all of their actions was honorable, and not all of their lives were honorable.
These were men, first and foremost, and being men, they never claimed perfection. They sought a better way of life for themselves and their fellow citizens, and that is why we view them through the lens of history and see them as GREAT men.
Hope this is helpful.
Russ Wickstrom
Minneapolis, MN
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M$You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
A moot point but still merits being said: You didn't back it up with a source of any kind. I had no idea Washington spent that kind of wad. I could probably take a sizable poll and I'm willing to guess that 98% or better would not know that.
To call it common knowledge is a bit of a stretch, unless you're academically in the history field.or you are a tour guide in Mt. Vernon.
And I--and you, for that matter-- stand corrected: There was some documentation:
"Take, for example, the entry on June 22, 1775:
To cash paid for Sadlery, a Letter Case, Maps, Glasses, &c &c &c. for the use of my Command... $831.45
Eight hundred dollars? Ten times what a private made for saddles? That must have been some pretty damn nice tackwork. £3, or about $81, went to the letter case, which was made of Russian leather. We're sure it kept his letters very dry. As for those "&c"s, they were probably worth a couple hundred each. Washington was a great fan of "&c" and "Ditto". There are innumerable "ditto"s in the account, most of which cost at least a hundred dollars. Other bits of finery are equally outlandish:
To sundry Exp.'s paid by myself at different times and places... on the Retreat of the Army thro' the Jerseys into Pennsylvania & while there... $3,776.
Yes, George Washington charged thousands of dollars to retreat from the enemy. He also gave loans to his friends that were never repaid, he bought limes by the crateload (400 at one point), and he treated himself to every "sundry" good available. From July 21-22 1775, he bought a pig, an unreadable number of ducks, "1 dozen pigeons, veal, 1 dozen squash, 2 dozen eggs, hurtleberries, biscuit and a cork cask."3 The Washington family diet for the month of August included chickens, oysters, whortleberries, pears, cucumbers, veal, mutton, bread, and milk. In October, they bought nearly 32 dozen eggs. Washington's taste for Madeira wine shows up with mindnumbing regularity: from September 1775 to March 1776, Washington spent over six thousand dollars on booze.4] He was careful enough to note a change in his wine supplier no less than three times."
SOURCE: http://www.historyhouse.com/in_history/washington/
Where did you get that info from if it wasn't documented over 200 years ago?
He blew that on overdue book fines:
"The first president of the United States of America borrowed two books from the New York Society Library in 1789 but failed to return them.
Adjusted for inflation, he has since racked up $300,000 in fines for being some 220 years late.
The New York Society Library says it will not pursue the fine. It would simply like the books back. "
SOURCE: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8627835.stm
He did have a salary of $25,000--and yes, he refused it.
SOURCE: http://www.potus.com/gwashington.html
Besides, he spent more--almost $250,000 more.:
"So, in the end, how much did Washington spend over his eight years of service?
$449,261.51, in 1780 dollars."
SOURCE: http://www.historyhouse.com/in_history/washington/
I am not interested in what 98% of people know. I said it was common knowledge to me. I didn't provide a reference dur to the fact that it was some textbook back in University thirty years ago. So it was still in my mind therefore making it common knowledge to me. As I clearly stated I did it from common lnowledge and made no reference to any other person's knowledge.
Additionally I did not say all his expenses were undocumented I said there were expenses that were undocumented. You took it to mean all. And as I stated in my last statement "they did not know if that was all he spent."
I am not a historian nor a tour guide at Mt. Vernon but I also know that Jefferson rebuilt his House at Monticello numerous times and changed it after coming back from Europe. He was quite a fan of architecture and even redid small houses that he rented out and never lived in. Maybe 98% of people don't know this also but to me it is common knowledge.
Overdue book fines has nothing to do with what he spent. I guess they had to drop it on a guy who was dead 200 years.
You say he did have a salary but he refused it-I said he said don't pay me. Same meaning in diifferent words.
I said he spent over $300,000 you said $449,261. Same meaning you just took the time to research something you did not know. I did it from common knowledge. Additionally they do not know if that was all he spent.
So why do you vote down an answer that you have parroted with sources that agree with what I have stated.
About 15 years ago, give or take a few, on a nice day, I'd take my lunch and sit on a bench in Lafayette Park, just two blocks away from my office. I'd marvel at the large white building behind the fence across the street--1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW--and wonder what kept people busy in that building.
I recently--very recently--came to the realization that what was at the very right of my view was The West Wing of that building, and that at that time (my office moved a few blocks away in 1998), what was keeping at least one person busy was Monica Lewinsky.
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M$
