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The internet is probably the most disruptive technology we have seen, and as rapidly as it is changing I doubt there will be a consensus on this issue any time soon. The problem is that change is nearly always painful for an established industry, even though it is ultimately beneficial in the long run. Here's how I see it:
* * * Customers Want: * * *
People want to be able to sit down, hit a few key strokes and mouse clicks, and then have their content appear. They want content to come in a variety of user friendly flavors for a single low price. They want content to be viewable from their computer, their home theater screen, their iPod, their cell phone and anything else they have that is capable of displaying a moving image.
* * * Short Term Harm of Streaming and Piracy: * * *
Groups like the MPAA have been attacking their customers instead of marketing to them. In order to get what they want, customers entered a technological arms race and learned how to circumvent copyright protections. A somewhat honest Joe that just wants to stick all of his movies on a digital home entertainment jukebox or copy them to a mobile device so that they can watch them on the subway must become a criminal to do so. Once he crosses that line and becomes liable for fines and prosecution, he sees no reason not to share his efforts with others. After all, his is already a "criminal" and he just spent an hour or three ripping the file, so why not save friends from this hassle and share the file? Ripping content has turned into a sort of underground community service and file sharing lets people distribute this labor rather than go it alone.
This is why groups like "The Pirate Bay" spring into existence. Consumers treat piracy like an underground rebellion against oppression. Piracy is much more than stealing free content, it is a way to strike back at content providers that attack their customers rather than provide what they want. This mentality has greatly contributed to the "why pay for it when I can steal it" attitude and likely does hurt DVD sales right now.
* * * Long Term Benefit of Streaming and Piracy: * * *
Sooner or later, the big film companies will have no choice but to surrender to the inevitable and give consumers what they want. The instant they do so, a whole new world will open up and it likely will involve a lot more jobs and money. Imagine scenarios where a consumer could go to a movie theater and optionally pay an extra $20 for their ticket and be handed a collectible with a built in encryption token that would let them stream the film for free the moment it leaves the theater and in the mean time listen to the score or sound track. People would go to the theater more often instead of waiting to watch it on NetFlix. Imagine a scenario in which you buy a high definition DVD for your home theater that is embedded with a serial number that could be used to download or stream low resolution versions of the film for use on other devices. DVD sales would soar! Imagine if your DVD gave you access to a studio run bit torrent tracker that would allow you to download the same content in any format you liked so that you could legally watch it on every device you owned? All of these things could win back customer loyalty and increase sales.
Once studios fully embrace streaming, it will create an opportunity to produce niche content at a profit. It might not be worth spending $200 million on a film of limited appeal, but a lower quality $2 million dollar film that is optimized for small screen viewing and intended for streaming might be able to make a huge profit. Small budget independent content creators would likely come out of the woodwork if the MPAA was the equivalent of the iPhone App Store instead of a thug. People could create content, upload it to the MPAA store, let the MPAA handle billing and bandwidth and then wait for their money to trickle in. Look at how succesfully iTunes has become at selling legal music over the internet.
* * * One last thought: * * *
In the short term, I doubt that streaming/sharing is harming sales as much as some people think. People who spend hours on the computer searching out content to steal are likely the biggest fans of movies. While they are breaking the law with their actions, I bet most of them also see a lot of films in the theater and buy a lot of legitimate content. Print novelists have discovered that giving away their content as free eBooks and even free podcast novels has helped them build loyal followings and increase sales. Even Metallica got their start in part because of the popularity of their bootleg concert recordings, and this popularity fuels their album sales to this day.
Sorry for the long essay. As you can tell, this is something that really interests me. Good luck with "I'll Believe You" on DVD.
Source(s):
http://www.forbes.com/2006/11/30/cory-doctorow-copyright-tech-media_cz_cd_b...
http://www.wired.com/underwire/2009/04/trent-reznor-wa/
http://www.podiobooks.com/blog/2008/08/25/scott-sigler-on-the-future-of-pub...
http://hubpages.com/hub/selfpublishbookgiveitaway
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/youth-radio-youth-media-international/why-mor...
http://chrisgeier.blogspot.com/2009/01/give-it-away.html
http://www.writing-world.com/promotion/promo07.shtml
http://www.foviance.com/what-we-think/the-secret-to-making-money-on-the-web...
http://travisheermann.com/blog/?p=220
http://www.iprong.com/musicianinterviews/scott-sigler-interview/
http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2009/08/itunes-sells-25-of-all-music-in-t...
http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/06/itunes-sells-6-billion-songs-and-other...
http://www.moneymorning.com/2009/08/18/netflix-video-rental/
http://windowsitpro.com/article/articleid/101431/microsoft-cites-success-of...
http://hothardware.com/News/The-Future-of-Netflix-is-All-About-Streaming/
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I rent movies very freqently however. I have an account with blockbuster online where I can trade the movies in the store if I want and they send me movies in the mail too.
I have had some experience with movies streamed online, and I really do not care for them that much. Most of the ones I have tried to watch were not very good quality. Even if they are in great quality I still would rather watch them on a tv because they usually have bigger screens, lol.
That is only my opinion though, but I really believe that any serious movie goer would feel the same way about getting the best quality viewing as possible and not just a cheap copy.
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There's no doubt about it. Online video has decimated the local DVD shop business. Blockbuster (the biggest name on the highstreet) is in major difficulties because of the kicking its had by streaming video from the net, video on demand from cable/satellite services, and the DVD via post Netflix/lovefilm model.
And thats without mentioning the any piracy issues at all.
Ilegal downloads of films probably are taking a chunk out of the market. How much is difficult to quantify. Robert Llewellyn (of cult UK TV show Red-Dwarf) recently was on This Week In Tech, and was asked how online video effected sales of the new Red Dwarf special released this year on DVD. He said
---quote---
Robert Llewellyn
Tom Merritt:-
Now I’m interesting – interested with something Robert said about how you felt the effect of piracy on Red Dwarf. Do you think though that people are exaggerating how much damage has been done. Because a lot of times the industry comes out with these billions and billions of dollars, or do you think that that’s dead on?
Robert Llewellyn:-
I mean I think it has had an effect, there’s no doubt about. I mean, I know the people who for instance. particularly with Red Dwarf, I know the people very well who distribute that DVD, a big company in the UK. And their overall sales across the board are down 20%. Now that isn’t, in some ways isn’t as much as I would have expected, I would have thought it was more. And one of the interesting things that we’ve found out recently and it’ll be – it’ll take time before we know for sure, but, so for instance we did this new, a new series of Red Dwarf this year, which was shown on UKTV.
Now I was getting messages, I was getting Twitter messages within 20 minutes of it being broadcasted in the UK from the US, people who has seen in the US and were making comments on it, because they – someone had, you know copied it, put it on to a bit torrent and someone opened it in America and had seen it. I mean, it was – it was within – it was breathtaking how quickly it happened. And there were something like 2.5 million bit torrent, it was being tracked. But what’s interesting is, from what I’ve heard, it hasn’t affected DVD sales, i.e., people who downloaded it and watched it went ‘oh that’s really good I want to see it and have now bought the DVD.’ So it’s really – it’s a really difficult thing – the producer of Red Dwarf was thrilled when he heard about how many bit torrents there were. Because he thought it was a very good sign, you know, so it’s a very mixed –
Tom Merritt:-
That’s very enlightened.
Robert Llewellyn:-
Well he is very enlightened. The people who – the people from the TV company were less thrilled strangely.
---quote----
So, without a direct pipe into the online distribution machines, how can an independant film maker get their work onto the screens of people at home?
If you can get a fanbase who have seen it, and who love it, then I think that they can get behind the film/project and go out and buy it. Even evangelise for it if you like... The social media connection is something that can be used to build momentum if the audience feels it has a connection with the artists.
Building that connection is very hard work however, and certainly isn't a quick fix.
Source(s):
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Blockbuster-to-shutter-as-apf-158686565.html?...
http://wiki.twit.tv/wiki/TWiT_203/Transcript
Tags: twit, blockbuster, dwarf, red, netflix
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Yes surely the online streaming of movies dent the sales of the DVDs and even affects the theater going crowd. Now a days, as streaming of movies is so easily available on the internet, most percentage of people watch movies online and do not take interest in buying or renting DVDs
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I am not aware of the percentage that will affect the sales of a DVD launch, but I am sure that it will hurt sales even if it is just a small portion of it, and for that, you should account for.
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"Every studio would likely come to different terms, but most would receive around 60 percent of the revenue from each rental, with a floor of about $2.40 that could vary depending on the age of the title, the person said. That's very similar to the studios' deals with other online outfits, as well as those agreed upon with cable operators such as Comcast Corp., which offer videos on demand.
The "window" — or the time lag between the sales date of DVDs and their rental, which is meant to protect sagging DVD sales — could be 30 days or more."
The very last line was very telling. . .
"(sic) However, Warner Bros. has been allowing video-on-demand rentals on the same day that its DVDs hit retailers. The move has boosted sales and not hurt physical disc rentals, which don't generate as much profit as digital ones."
http://tech.yahoo.com/news/ap/20090903/ap_on_hi_te/us_youtube_hollywood
Like you I do a huge amount of my movie viewing through streaming & Netflix rental & I rarely buy, so I personally suspected it might hinder sales. So what is causing Warner Bros' upshot in sales without loss in DVD rentals?
I have on rare occasion enjoyed a streamed movie so much that I have decided to get the DVD, perhaps this happens more often then I thought in the mass market?
If this is the case the sales may even enjoy the double dip of the viewing that generates add revenue or rental revenue, followed by a purchase of a DVD, a nice win+win.
You may want to follow up with this question: How often do people buy a DVD after viewing it as a rental or stream?
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With online streaming video's (some of which can be found for free), the producers are forced to create better movies if they still wish to make a profit. They have to make a movie that is WORTHY of being purchased! They can no longer sit back and throw advertising dollars at a movie and expect to sucker people into buying a crappy movie! Consumers are tired of being fooled by movie trailers that show you great scenes, only to be seriously disappointed when they watch the movie and discover that those were the ONLY good scenes in the whole movie! Now consumers can watch the movie without fear of wasting their hard earned wages, and decide if it’s worth the money to own it.
As for movie theater sales, I think people will ALWAYS flock to the theaters to see movies. There is something about the theater experience that you simply cannot recreate at home.
If production companies are smart, they will devise a way to start streaming videos themselves. ;-)
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The long answer: This would be the time to start pioneering a similar to Mahalo, 'tip' related streaming for films. Stream the film on your website in a reliable format, with excellent quality, focus, etc... and explain that if you like it, please paypal a tip. When you leave a tip, you leave a review. The novelty of it would bring more viewers and possibly start a revenue basis for indie films. Not a huge one, but you never know. If someone likes it a lot, and supports your work, they could leave a huge tip.
The point being, it creates a community around the film, that will then grow with you as your company grows. Community is the one thing we all crave, and it brings together like-minded people. So use the monster to overcome the monster...
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Source(s):
wikipedia.com
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What hurts is when people download and play movies from underground sites posting free rips of DVDs, or when people download DVD rips from torrent sites.
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For those interested, there is a relate online poll on this topic at sodahead.com
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If you have an obscure film from an obscure studio if you try and sell it solely as a DVD your sales will be negligible.
One of the only feasible ways to market your film is online. You should not think providing a free or very cheap online version will hurt your DVD sales you should think of it as marketing. If your film is any good each online viewing will likely generate two DVD sales. Studies have shown that persons who are the heaviest down loaders of pirate music are also the heaviest purchasers of physical CD's.
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Source(s):
http://www.dailynews.com/ci_13345165
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I don't have time or the inclination to go to the video store and I don't buy DVDs because after I've seen something once, I really have no desire to watch it again.
My take on it is, the online streamers are probably people who wouldn't have or don't buy or rent DVDs anyway, and the people who do buy or rent DVDs probably aren't big streamers. Given that, I think having it available both as a DVD and for streaming would get more sales total - I can't see it would actually hurt DVD sales that much. And some people who watch and really like it streaming will maybe buy the DVD too - so you can offer a good price to stream, and a discount to buy the DVD for those who did purchase the stream, and actually make more sales/money than if you only offered DVD.
Plus, if you don't offer a legit stream, you run the risk of someone offering on not so legit.
I say both... but as I said, that's just my take on it from my own choices about DVDs and streaming.
Good question though and good luck with the film!
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Answered Question
M$6.05
September 16, 2009 06:03 AM
Do you think the online streaming movie link sites hurt movie DVD sales and rentals?
I am a self-employed incredibly busy ADD person and honestly just don't go to the theatre as much as I used to...and, personally I don't even really rent DVDs anymore because I either rent and/or watch online while I'm working.
I am in the process of marketing the release of an independent film on DVD (www.illbelieveyoudvd.com). Released to a few theatres Nov 2008 and now on DVD. This is a family, comedy, sci-fi, rate PG so there are a few routes (parenting, family, women, comedy, etc.) that would enjoy this flick. The cast is great (David Alan Basche, Patrick Warburton, Chris Elliott, Fred Willard, Ed Helms, Mo Rocca, Thomas Gibson...and more). We are pushing the standard retail routes...Amazon, iTunes, Netflix, Blockbuster, and others but even the video rental stores -- many are not going to carry this small film.
My personal opinion (again...I'm in marketing so my personal opinion isn't really the demographic for this family film) is that watching a movie that I would probably never go see in a theatre or maybe never even rent just because I have access and find it interesting, I think is better than never hearing about it at all. Some recent films that I don't even remember gonig to theatre that I probably would have never have seen are: The Golden Boys, The Answer Man, Lymelife, Gigantic and so many more.
I'm just wondering if having links to a version on some of the streaming movie sites really hurts sales or promotes movie awareness.
I am in the process of marketing the release of an independent film on DVD (www.illbelieveyoudvd.com). Released to a few theatres Nov 2008 and now on DVD. This is a family, comedy, sci-fi, rate PG so there are a few routes (parenting, family, women, comedy, etc.) that would enjoy this flick. The cast is great (David Alan Basche, Patrick Warburton, Chris Elliott, Fred Willard, Ed Helms, Mo Rocca, Thomas Gibson...and more). We are pushing the standard retail routes...Amazon, iTunes, Netflix, Blockbuster, and others but even the video rental stores -- many are not going to carry this small film.
My personal opinion (again...I'm in marketing so my personal opinion isn't really the demographic for this family film) is that watching a movie that I would probably never go see in a theatre or maybe never even rent just because I have access and find it interesting, I think is better than never hearing about it at all. Some recent films that I don't even remember gonig to theatre that I probably would have never have seen are: The Golden Boys, The Answer Man, Lymelife, Gigantic and so many more.
I'm just wondering if having links to a version on some of the streaming movie sites really hurts sales or promotes movie awareness.
Interesting Question?
Yes (4)
No (0)
Interesting: eagle6912 M$0.25, chriswingate M$0.25, joyannj M$0.50, michelleldevon M$0.05
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| September 16, 2009 06:12 PM |
* * * Customers Want: * * *
People want to be able to sit down, hit a few key strokes and mouse clicks, and then have their content appear. They want content to come in a variety of user friendly flavors for a single low price. They want content to be viewable from their computer, their home theater screen, their iPod, their cell phone and anything else they have that is capable of displaying a moving image.
* * * Short Term Harm of Streaming and Piracy: * * *
Groups like the MPAA have been attacking their customers instead of marketing to them. In order to get what they want, customers entered a technological arms race and learned how to circumvent copyright protections. A somewhat honest Joe that just wants to stick all of his movies on a digital home entertainment jukebox or copy them to a mobile device so that they can watch them on the subway must become a criminal to do so. Once he crosses that line and becomes liable for fines and prosecution, he sees no reason not to share his efforts with others. After all, his is already a "criminal" and he just spent an hour or three ripping the file, so why not save friends from this hassle and share the file? Ripping content has turned into a sort of underground community service and file sharing lets people distribute this labor rather than go it alone.
This is why groups like "The Pirate Bay" spring into existence. Consumers treat piracy like an underground rebellion against oppression. Piracy is much more than stealing free content, it is a way to strike back at content providers that attack their customers rather than provide what they want. This mentality has greatly contributed to the "why pay for it when I can steal it" attitude and likely does hurt DVD sales right now.
* * * Long Term Benefit of Streaming and Piracy: * * *
Sooner or later, the big film companies will have no choice but to surrender to the inevitable and give consumers what they want. The instant they do so, a whole new world will open up and it likely will involve a lot more jobs and money. Imagine scenarios where a consumer could go to a movie theater and optionally pay an extra $20 for their ticket and be handed a collectible with a built in encryption token that would let them stream the film for free the moment it leaves the theater and in the mean time listen to the score or sound track. People would go to the theater more often instead of waiting to watch it on NetFlix. Imagine a scenario in which you buy a high definition DVD for your home theater that is embedded with a serial number that could be used to download or stream low resolution versions of the film for use on other devices. DVD sales would soar! Imagine if your DVD gave you access to a studio run bit torrent tracker that would allow you to download the same content in any format you liked so that you could legally watch it on every device you owned? All of these things could win back customer loyalty and increase sales.
Once studios fully embrace streaming, it will create an opportunity to produce niche content at a profit. It might not be worth spending $200 million on a film of limited appeal, but a lower quality $2 million dollar film that is optimized for small screen viewing and intended for streaming might be able to make a huge profit. Small budget independent content creators would likely come out of the woodwork if the MPAA was the equivalent of the iPhone App Store instead of a thug. People could create content, upload it to the MPAA store, let the MPAA handle billing and bandwidth and then wait for their money to trickle in. Look at how succesfully iTunes has become at selling legal music over the internet.
* * * One last thought: * * *
In the short term, I doubt that streaming/sharing is harming sales as much as some people think. People who spend hours on the computer searching out content to steal are likely the biggest fans of movies. While they are breaking the law with their actions, I bet most of them also see a lot of films in the theater and buy a lot of legitimate content. Print novelists have discovered that giving away their content as free eBooks and even free podcast novels has helped them build loyal followings and increase sales. Even Metallica got their start in part because of the popularity of their bootleg concert recordings, and this popularity fuels their album sales to this day.
Sorry for the long essay. As you can tell, this is something that really interests me. Good luck with "I'll Believe You" on DVD.
Source(s):
http://www.forbes.com/2006/11/30/cory-doctorow-copyright-tech-media_cz_cd_b...
http://www.wired.com/underwire/2009/04/trent-reznor-wa/
http://www.podiobooks.com/blog/2008/08/25/scott-sigler-on-the-future-of-pub...
http://hubpages.com/hub/selfpublishbookgiveitaway
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/youth-radio-youth-media-international/why-mor...
http://chrisgeier.blogspot.com/2009/01/give-it-away.html
http://www.writing-world.com/promotion/promo07.shtml
http://www.foviance.com/what-we-think/the-secret-to-making-money-on-the-web...
http://travisheermann.com/blog/?p=220
http://www.iprong.com/musicianinterviews/scott-sigler-interview/
http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2009/08/itunes-sells-25-of-all-music-in-t...
http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/06/itunes-sells-6-billion-songs-and-other...
http://www.moneymorning.com/2009/08/18/netflix-video-rental/
http://windowsitpro.com/article/articleid/101431/microsoft-cites-success-of...
http://hothardware.com/News/The-Future-of-Netflix-is-All-About-Streaming/
| Asker's Rating: |
• Thanks you for your detailed answer - you brought up some great points. I think as Cheapgamer suggested I will post a question asking about DVD purchases after streaming as a follow up.
Thanks EVERYONE for posting an answer.
Mahalo
Thanks EVERYONE for posting an answer.
Mahalo
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Helpful: stanar, chriswingate, mysterygirl89, ashasekayi, ghanan20003000, shadowbear
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Other Answers (19)
September 16, 2009 06:55 AM
I really don't think that online streaming site hurt sale that much, if any at all. I love watching movies. Going to a theatre to see a GOOD movie is one of my favorite this to do. Especially if they are in 3D, like 'My Bloody Valentine'. I don't have money to go to movies often though. I rent movies very freqently however. I have an account with blockbuster online where I can trade the movies in the store if I want and they send me movies in the mail too.
I have had some experience with movies streamed online, and I really do not care for them that much. Most of the ones I have tried to watch were not very good quality. Even if they are in great quality I still would rather watch them on a tv because they usually have bigger screens, lol.
That is only my opinion though, but I really believe that any serious movie goer would feel the same way about getting the best quality viewing as possible and not just a cheap copy.
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September 16, 2009 07:26 AM
No, I don't think so that online streaming movie link sites can really hurt the sales and rentals of DVD market. We can really enjoy to watch the movie only because of the sound & picture quality which only DVDs have. If we want to watch & enjoy movie, online, first all our broadband/internet should have the speed. Secondly, picture clarity & sound clarity must be good and also movie can be watched smoothly & continuously
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September 16, 2009 07:46 PM
Some streaming sites (example of Netflix) have High Def viewing as an option... I can watch several streaming movies through my xbox with Netflix, on my big screen 1080p screen with surround sound playing... this shows the picture and sound quality to be just as enjoyable as going to a movie theater without having to deal with the expensive cost!
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September 16, 2009 07:48 PM
Do you have any sources that back this?
I'm not sure how true that really is... the cost to press a DVD is in the pennies and distributing isn't much more... DVD quality streaming has bandwidth cost that have to be considered which you are likely not taking into consideration.
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I'm not sure how true that really is... the cost to press a DVD is in the pennies and distributing isn't much more... DVD quality streaming has bandwidth cost that have to be considered which you are likely not taking into consideration.
September 16, 2009 08:05 AM
Online video kills the DVD star.... There's no doubt about it. Online video has decimated the local DVD shop business. Blockbuster (the biggest name on the highstreet) is in major difficulties because of the kicking its had by streaming video from the net, video on demand from cable/satellite services, and the DVD via post Netflix/lovefilm model.
And thats without mentioning the any piracy issues at all.
Ilegal downloads of films probably are taking a chunk out of the market. How much is difficult to quantify. Robert Llewellyn (of cult UK TV show Red-Dwarf) recently was on This Week In Tech, and was asked how online video effected sales of the new Red Dwarf special released this year on DVD. He said
---quote---
Robert Llewellyn
Tom Merritt:-
Now I’m interesting – interested with something Robert said about how you felt the effect of piracy on Red Dwarf. Do you think though that people are exaggerating how much damage has been done. Because a lot of times the industry comes out with these billions and billions of dollars, or do you think that that’s dead on?
Robert Llewellyn:-
I mean I think it has had an effect, there’s no doubt about. I mean, I know the people who for instance. particularly with Red Dwarf, I know the people very well who distribute that DVD, a big company in the UK. And their overall sales across the board are down 20%. Now that isn’t, in some ways isn’t as much as I would have expected, I would have thought it was more. And one of the interesting things that we’ve found out recently and it’ll be – it’ll take time before we know for sure, but, so for instance we did this new, a new series of Red Dwarf this year, which was shown on UKTV.
Now I was getting messages, I was getting Twitter messages within 20 minutes of it being broadcasted in the UK from the US, people who has seen in the US and were making comments on it, because they – someone had, you know copied it, put it on to a bit torrent and someone opened it in America and had seen it. I mean, it was – it was within – it was breathtaking how quickly it happened. And there were something like 2.5 million bit torrent, it was being tracked. But what’s interesting is, from what I’ve heard, it hasn’t affected DVD sales, i.e., people who downloaded it and watched it went ‘oh that’s really good I want to see it and have now bought the DVD.’ So it’s really – it’s a really difficult thing – the producer of Red Dwarf was thrilled when he heard about how many bit torrents there were. Because he thought it was a very good sign, you know, so it’s a very mixed –
Tom Merritt:-
That’s very enlightened.
Robert Llewellyn:-
Well he is very enlightened. The people who – the people from the TV company were less thrilled strangely.
---quote----
So, without a direct pipe into the online distribution machines, how can an independant film maker get their work onto the screens of people at home?
If you can get a fanbase who have seen it, and who love it, then I think that they can get behind the film/project and go out and buy it. Even evangelise for it if you like... The social media connection is something that can be used to build momentum if the audience feels it has a connection with the artists.
Building that connection is very hard work however, and certainly isn't a quick fix.
Source(s):
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Blockbuster-to-shutter-as-apf-158686565.html?...
http://wiki.twit.tv/wiki/TWiT_203/Transcript
Tags: twit, blockbuster, dwarf, red, netflix
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September 16, 2009 09:48 AM
Hi, Yes surely the online streaming of movies dent the sales of the DVDs and even affects the theater going crowd. Now a days, as streaming of movies is so easily available on the internet, most percentage of people watch movies online and do not take interest in buying or renting DVDs
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September 16, 2009 11:43 AM
Hi. Unfortunately, I believe that the answer to your question is YES. I am convinced that online movies, just like anything else (e.g. music), can hurt the traditional DVD because simply put it is available online, and sometimes for free. Obviously the quality is not comparable to that of the original track and for this, there will always be someone who would prefer watching it on a theater or otherwise rent it and watch on a mega wide HDTV. I recall an example of a local documentary that was released here about three weeks ago and it is now downloadable online. People can even buy it, but there is always someone who will copy it and upload it on the internet. I am not aware of the percentage that will affect the sales of a DVD launch, but I am sure that it will hurt sales even if it is just a small portion of it, and for that, you should account for.
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September 16, 2009 01:44 PM
I found an article about YouTube streaming movie rentals. I think the key is to set up in a manner that you are comfortable with. "Every studio would likely come to different terms, but most would receive around 60 percent of the revenue from each rental, with a floor of about $2.40 that could vary depending on the age of the title, the person said. That's very similar to the studios' deals with other online outfits, as well as those agreed upon with cable operators such as Comcast Corp., which offer videos on demand.
The "window" — or the time lag between the sales date of DVDs and their rental, which is meant to protect sagging DVD sales — could be 30 days or more."
The very last line was very telling. . .
"(sic) However, Warner Bros. has been allowing video-on-demand rentals on the same day that its DVDs hit retailers. The move has boosted sales and not hurt physical disc rentals, which don't generate as much profit as digital ones."
http://tech.yahoo.com/news/ap/20090903/ap_on_hi_te/us_youtube_hollywood
Like you I do a huge amount of my movie viewing through streaming & Netflix rental & I rarely buy, so I personally suspected it might hinder sales. So what is causing Warner Bros' upshot in sales without loss in DVD rentals?
I have on rare occasion enjoyed a streamed movie so much that I have decided to get the DVD, perhaps this happens more often then I thought in the mass market?
If this is the case the sales may even enjoy the double dip of the viewing that generates add revenue or rental revenue, followed by a purchase of a DVD, a nice win+win.
You may want to follow up with this question: How often do people buy a DVD after viewing it as a rental or stream?
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September 17, 2009 08:20 AM
I was actually wondering if that 30 day lag time was going away? Our movie was released on DVD Sept. 8 and that day the movie was available for online rental from Netflix, Warner, Amazon, iTunes. Even though the movie was released on DVD that day, because it's not a big box office film it's hard to find on the "shelves". At least I can't find it in my area. I'm trying to find out from the distributor where they actually sent DVDs.
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September 17, 2009 09:52 PM
That is interesting, I wonder if the distributor is hitting specific key markets . . . I wonder what those would be? By the way it's good to know that it is on Netflix, I will have to add it to my queue ^_^
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September 16, 2009 03:48 PM
I think that it DOES hurt the sales to some extent, but not NEARLY to the extent that some people claim. I believe that online streaming is a good thing! I think it "evens the odds" so to speak, for consumers. This is one of the few industries where satisfaction is NOT guaranteed! If you visit a theater, or purchase / rent a DVD, you can’t get your money back if you thought it was terrible! With online streaming video's (some of which can be found for free), the producers are forced to create better movies if they still wish to make a profit. They have to make a movie that is WORTHY of being purchased! They can no longer sit back and throw advertising dollars at a movie and expect to sucker people into buying a crappy movie! Consumers are tired of being fooled by movie trailers that show you great scenes, only to be seriously disappointed when they watch the movie and discover that those were the ONLY good scenes in the whole movie! Now consumers can watch the movie without fear of wasting their hard earned wages, and decide if it’s worth the money to own it.
As for movie theater sales, I think people will ALWAYS flock to the theaters to see movies. There is something about the theater experience that you simply cannot recreate at home.
If production companies are smart, they will devise a way to start streaming videos themselves. ;-)
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September 17, 2009 08:12 AM
I agree...and a lot of the studios have started including Warner Bros where our film is.
http://www.wbshop.com/I%27ll-Believe-You/261524_od,default,pd.html?cgid=
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http://www.wbshop.com/I%27ll-Believe-You/261524_od,default,pd.html?cgid=
September 16, 2009 08:10 PM
The short answer: No, I do not feel that it hurts business. If its a small film, this is probably the best way for it to be seen in the glut of everything that we are dealing with on a global media level. The long answer: This would be the time to start pioneering a similar to Mahalo, 'tip' related streaming for films. Stream the film on your website in a reliable format, with excellent quality, focus, etc... and explain that if you like it, please paypal a tip. When you leave a tip, you leave a review. The novelty of it would bring more viewers and possibly start a revenue basis for indie films. Not a huge one, but you never know. If someone likes it a lot, and supports your work, they could leave a huge tip.
The point being, it creates a community around the film, that will then grow with you as your company grows. Community is the one thing we all crave, and it brings together like-minded people. So use the monster to overcome the monster...
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September 16, 2009 08:21 PM
no because the movie companies recv money from the internet company before they release the clip to the site to be displayed . that is why the internet company charges you do dwn load the full clip. keith/ question what is your ethinc background?
Source(s):
wikipedia.com
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September 16, 2009 09:30 PM
Well, they might reduce sales of the movies in DVD format, but it's not hurting the movie makers because they get broadcast fees from the legitimate internet movie streamers. In fact, movie makers prefer it that way, because it saves them the cost of printing and distributing the DVDs. What hurts is when people download and play movies from underground sites posting free rips of DVDs, or when people download DVD rips from torrent sites.
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September 16, 2009 10:41 PM
I think that "business as usual" has been hurt by the streaming process, but the studios have money making avenues open to them Online, that they never had before. It also may benefit us, the public, as maybe better movies will be produced so that they can still attract moviegoers, who don't want to pay $10 a head and waste it on a boring/bad flick. (Although that was not a part of your question.) My belief is that small/Indie flicks can be better promoted/watched Online and then maybe purchased if they are good.
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September 17, 2009 08:25 AM
I was referring to all of them...free, bit torrents, pay sites, etc. The online streaming sites in general.
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September 17, 2009 12:44 AM
Now a days people likes it fast. Not to mentions the way we eat. For examples the availability of grab and go breakfast, fast food chains. We like it fast. So technology was created to help us do things in a nice and fastest way we could imagine. Like the cellphones. Before messages are sent through mails, phone calls, beepers, but thinks to the technology we can send messages in and instant just by using your phone. It's also true when it comes to movies. Some people might find it tiring to go to a movie house. And some might not like to mingle in the crowded movies houses. So what, i have my laptop with me available for. So some people will just browse through their laptops and watch movies, and to think that browsing is not that expensive. So it really hurt those ventures selling and renting DVD's. Technology is good but sometimes it can us back at all.
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September 17, 2009 02:52 AM
I think it has - it is the natural progression of the technology. The fight between Blu-Ray and HD-DVD did not really leave behind any victors. I personally use my Apple TV as well as ATT U-Verse to rent movies. but there are many other options including netflix streaming through a variety of set-top boxes. For those interested, there is a relate online poll on this topic at sodahead.com
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September 17, 2009 02:57 AM
Marketing costs money. If you have an obscure film from an obscure studio if you try and sell it solely as a DVD your sales will be negligible.
One of the only feasible ways to market your film is online. You should not think providing a free or very cheap online version will hurt your DVD sales you should think of it as marketing. If your film is any good each online viewing will likely generate two DVD sales. Studies have shown that persons who are the heaviest down loaders of pirate music are also the heaviest purchasers of physical CD's.
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September 17, 2009 08:24 AM
This is a study I'd be interested in seeing because like I said in some of my other comments. I just have a feeling that downloaders do buy as well...they are just movie enthusiasts in general.
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September 22, 2009 04:12 AM
Study: pirates biggest music buyers. Labels: yeah, right
Those who download "free" music from P2P networks are more likely to spend money on legit downloads than those who are squeaky clean, according to a new report out of Norway. The music labels, however, aren't quite buying that data.
http://arstechnica.com/media/news/2009/04/study-pirates-buy-tons-more-music-than-average-folks.ars
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Those who download "free" music from P2P networks are more likely to spend money on legit downloads than those who are squeaky clean, according to a new report out of Norway. The music labels, however, aren't quite buying that data.
http://arstechnica.com/media/news/2009/04/study-pirates-buy-tons-more-music-than-average-folks.ars
September 17, 2009 05:56 AM
Yes. Blockbuster just announced the closing of nearly one thousand of its stores. We've only just begun seeing the decline of DVD sales. Selling discs will quickly join the ash heap of history.
Source(s):
http://www.dailynews.com/ci_13345165
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September 17, 2009 05:57 AM
I can only offer you my personal opinion on it. I am extremely busy. I'm online about 20 hours per day (seriously) because I run websites for a living, including my writers forum and several others, and I also work online. I will sometimes stream a video and watch something in a little window while I'm working. I don't have time or the inclination to go to the video store and I don't buy DVDs because after I've seen something once, I really have no desire to watch it again.
My take on it is, the online streamers are probably people who wouldn't have or don't buy or rent DVDs anyway, and the people who do buy or rent DVDs probably aren't big streamers. Given that, I think having it available both as a DVD and for streaming would get more sales total - I can't see it would actually hurt DVD sales that much. And some people who watch and really like it streaming will maybe buy the DVD too - so you can offer a good price to stream, and a discount to buy the DVD for those who did purchase the stream, and actually make more sales/money than if you only offered DVD.
Plus, if you don't offer a legit stream, you run the risk of someone offering on not so legit.
I say both... but as I said, that's just my take on it from my own choices about DVDs and streaming.
Good question though and good luck with the film!
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September 17, 2009 06:52 AM
I think you're right, in that I too have noticed that people tend to get their video entertainment from the net, or via cable channels/satelite, and I haven't seen many, if any, who do a lot of stradling both, such that I would agree with you... that they should exist comfortably in parallel...
But I've noticed a few things that at first might seem kinda funny, but which isn't im the long run if you like good, professional, A class productions.
One is that it's an older crowd who still anchor themselves on the TV and satelite/cable for entertainment, and I think that as they pass, the percentage of how much revenue the movie maker gets from licenced streaming vs DVD sales will shift to streaming, which the makers shouldn't mind because it's easier to distribute via streaming than via DVD.
But, I've seen situations where a mother still glued to the tube has a son who visits his pal about once a week, taking with him a shopping list including suggestions from his mom, and he comes back with a stack of freshly burned DVDs... and she doesn't ask him anything about where they come from. That behavior can wipte out DVD sales without it being accounted for by a generational shift to an online audience.
Second, I'm aware of several instances of there being clubs where they pitch in to pay for one stream, and then using assorted clever technologies a single viewing is buffered and captured and encoded in ways that can be passed around as large files, such that there's a many to one ratio of internet-oriented viewers all piggybacking on the price of one online viewing.
Now... I know it's all kinda neat, and it's so easy to feel like you're clever and adventurous and entrepreneural and all that stuff... sticking it to the man... but there comes a point where the back of the production companies is really broken, and the movies stop.
You can see how there's a dilema there, because it is human nature to go for the best deal you can get, and it's all the more exciting if there's a riske aspect to it, and it can be fun watching uber-rich and powerful studio executives squirm, but there really does come a point where it's not funny anymore... when the studio exec and actors and film unions have made every compromise possible into middle-classdom, but the pirates still keep at it, until the industry is killed.
Options are to wait for the pirates to notice there's nothing to pirate anymore, such that they go find something else to do, during which there's a void of new films for... decades? During which time *something* is done with respect to implementing an enforcable regulatory scheme over the technology (hard to do, because the nature of technology is that it's made made, which means it can be man broken) such that it's hoped for hollywood to rise up again like a phoenix, or... I dunno... but honestly... there really does come a point where it's just not funny.
I have read some studies, and as much as I know people hate the T word, I'm sorry, but as a matter of fact, in terms of cost for a program to implement and as a function of the very valid statistical studies done on matching the sales of blank dvd's to all possible uses as per measurable expressions of use for all applications (real neat stuff using Chi squared analysis with orthoganal factor analysis and polynomial regressions), I know everyone's going to hate this, but in fact the powers that be have a pretty good idea what percentage of those blank dvds are going to copy movies, and it' a very straitforward arithmetic calculation to compensate film makers with a tax break exactly offset by a tax on blank dvds.
I know that americans in particular would rather see a system consisting of spy satelites that can do biometric readings of a human's brain that's triggered when that brain is watching a dvd it knows to be pirated by some sort of space-based modified lie-detection scheme so that helicopters with jack-booted body-armed gestapo can break into a house to arrest and beat up someone watching a bootleg dvd instead of pay one nickel of extra tax on a blank, but if you really want to keep taxes down, the simple fact is that the cheepest program to enforce is to cut taxes to the film makers, and exactly offset that with a tax on blank dvd's.
One way or another, sooner or later, *something's* going to have to happen, or the industry's dead and there will be no movies, so the question isn't, "will it be dealt with", rather it is, "when and how will it be dealt with".
Personally, I'm an advocate of that which is the simplest, fastest, and cheepest to implement... the one that causes the least amount of disruption to the industry and to ratios of overall spending that movie watchers are still mostly accustomed to, which means a drop in spending on theater tickets with an equal and offsettingp upping of the price for their blank dvds.
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But I've noticed a few things that at first might seem kinda funny, but which isn't im the long run if you like good, professional, A class productions.
One is that it's an older crowd who still anchor themselves on the TV and satelite/cable for entertainment, and I think that as they pass, the percentage of how much revenue the movie maker gets from licenced streaming vs DVD sales will shift to streaming, which the makers shouldn't mind because it's easier to distribute via streaming than via DVD.
But, I've seen situations where a mother still glued to the tube has a son who visits his pal about once a week, taking with him a shopping list including suggestions from his mom, and he comes back with a stack of freshly burned DVDs... and she doesn't ask him anything about where they come from. That behavior can wipte out DVD sales without it being accounted for by a generational shift to an online audience.
Second, I'm aware of several instances of there being clubs where they pitch in to pay for one stream, and then using assorted clever technologies a single viewing is buffered and captured and encoded in ways that can be passed around as large files, such that there's a many to one ratio of internet-oriented viewers all piggybacking on the price of one online viewing.
Now... I know it's all kinda neat, and it's so easy to feel like you're clever and adventurous and entrepreneural and all that stuff... sticking it to the man... but there comes a point where the back of the production companies is really broken, and the movies stop.
You can see how there's a dilema there, because it is human nature to go for the best deal you can get, and it's all the more exciting if there's a riske aspect to it, and it can be fun watching uber-rich and powerful studio executives squirm, but there really does come a point where it's not funny anymore... when the studio exec and actors and film unions have made every compromise possible into middle-classdom, but the pirates still keep at it, until the industry is killed.
Options are to wait for the pirates to notice there's nothing to pirate anymore, such that they go find something else to do, during which there's a void of new films for... decades? During which time *something* is done with respect to implementing an enforcable regulatory scheme over the technology (hard to do, because the nature of technology is that it's made made, which means it can be man broken) such that it's hoped for hollywood to rise up again like a phoenix, or... I dunno... but honestly... there really does come a point where it's just not funny.
I have read some studies, and as much as I know people hate the T word, I'm sorry, but as a matter of fact, in terms of cost for a program to implement and as a function of the very valid statistical studies done on matching the sales of blank dvd's to all possible uses as per measurable expressions of use for all applications (real neat stuff using Chi squared analysis with orthoganal factor analysis and polynomial regressions), I know everyone's going to hate this, but in fact the powers that be have a pretty good idea what percentage of those blank dvds are going to copy movies, and it' a very straitforward arithmetic calculation to compensate film makers with a tax break exactly offset by a tax on blank dvds.
I know that americans in particular would rather see a system consisting of spy satelites that can do biometric readings of a human's brain that's triggered when that brain is watching a dvd it knows to be pirated by some sort of space-based modified lie-detection scheme so that helicopters with jack-booted body-armed gestapo can break into a house to arrest and beat up someone watching a bootleg dvd instead of pay one nickel of extra tax on a blank, but if you really want to keep taxes down, the simple fact is that the cheepest program to enforce is to cut taxes to the film makers, and exactly offset that with a tax on blank dvd's.
One way or another, sooner or later, *something's* going to have to happen, or the industry's dead and there will be no movies, so the question isn't, "will it be dealt with", rather it is, "when and how will it be dealt with".
Personally, I'm an advocate of that which is the simplest, fastest, and cheepest to implement... the one that causes the least amount of disruption to the industry and to ratios of overall spending that movie watchers are still mostly accustomed to, which means a drop in spending on theater tickets with an equal and offsettingp upping of the price for their blank dvds.
September 17, 2009 08:26 AM
Thank you...personally I'm kinda there with you on watching once and the time. I only seem to go to movies with little kids.
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September 17, 2009 08:27 AM
Thank you...personally I'm kinda there with you on watching once and the time. I only seem to go to movies with little kids.
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And thank you, @archetypemkt for having such a pragmatic and practical view. It's encouraging to see people in the industry expressing views that could some day lead to more money for content creators and better access to entertainment for consumers.
I agree with @ghanan2000... that this answer deserves to be nominated for AOTD