2 years, 8 months ago
At what point do you decide that it's time to find a new job / become an entrepreneur?
This is the other question that's been on my mind lately. How do you know that it's time you start looking for a new job or that "maybe it's time to start that business..."?
What are warning signs to look for? What cues do you pick up on?
I'll give some examples from my own life: When I attended post-high school classes, I also worked a menial day job. It was obvious that it was time to move on once I completed schooling and got the licensing I needed. My next job, I was "asked to resign" because of an ongoing investigation and that "it may be in my best interest to remove myself from employment". The job after that, I was also asked to leave. I was employed the next day, for higher pay and stayed with that employer, reaching management level.
I stayed at that job for 4 years, and it became increasingly frustrating because I wasn't compensated at the same level with the same training as everyone else, yet I was continually made to fulfill those tasks. By this time, I had enough skills to make myself marketable, and moved on to the next job.
The next job was one I really liked because I had a much greater involvement with clients, I was free to determine how best to proceed with any given task, and I had interaction with other professionals as well on a daily basis. One accusation of wrong doing, with no proof, found me stripped of that position and assigned one of the worst details imaginable for three months. I had the gut feeling my employer wanted me to quit, but the plan backfired on them because my presence at that location cut problems down by 80% when I was there. The rest of the supervisory staff noticed this immediately and began to randomize when I would be present to keep the problem level down.
I was finally assigned to a better location that required a degree of skill in another language as well as good customer relation skills. This position was a lateral transfer for a slight pay increase. I was there for about a year until the position that got my foot into the bank's door opened. I moved on because as long as I stayed in my present position, I would advance no further and receive no increase in pay due to the incident.
When I was at the bank, it became immediately obvious that "Max knows how to find problems and get them solved." I spent three years supervising a staff of six, and finding and correcting problems. After those three years, my manager, at the direction of his manager, sent me to the main data processing facility to be their eyes and ears since I did my previous position well.
The position I filled was made vacant because that person was going to be moved to another position within the company. However, that was also the beginning of the second taste of "workplace politics" I had received.
The person I replaced ended up replacing my manager who resigned unexpectedly under "a cloud of mystery". He was not happy about the new position, and as my new direct supervisor, also resented my for replacing the person he had "hand picked" to succeed him. Shortly thereafter, as my new boss, he attempted to strip me of position and wanted to terminate me. The manager directly over him did a "Oh no you will NOT get rid of Max. Max will be coming back to headquarters and will take the desk directly in front of me." So, instead of losing favor, I received more of it, and was moved into administration with direct supervision over other managers and the related staff. My pay froze temporarily, and the manager who wanted me back at headquarters attempted to craft an appropriate position to get me from under the manager who didn't like me. That plan failed when a senior manager did a nepotism move and filled the position with an unqualified family member. This frustrated both the manager who wanted me, and my immediate manager.
Fast forward three years.
A new supervisor was put into place between the manager who didn't like me and himself. Every six months, the supervisor in that position would quit or request transfer out when they learned that I was paid more than them. I continued to receive pay raises despite my immediate manger's objections. His manager no longer would filter work through my manager, and instead would assign me directly, and I am now the head investigator for the electronic security division and writing training manuals for entire departments.
Managers above me were known to hand in my work as their own, and yet I still produced tremendous amount of data and doing investigations daily. When the manager who wanted me to work for him moved on. I should have taken that as a cue to move on, but didn't.
It took three months, and a case of sleep deprivation to cause me to not dot one "I", and my manager immediately jumped on that to use it to fire me. A one month severance was given to me very reluctantly, but they had to do so under contract. I used that time to find employment, and did so before the package ran dry.
My last employer lied to me from the start. I was paid less than what the position was advertised for, I was given duties other than what was agreed upon at hire, and I never received any increase in pay despite glowing reports from any and all clients and managers I came into contact with. I moved on because the television production studio I was volunteering my services at decided they needed to hire me on full time, and it allowed me to utilize training and expertise I hadn't used in a while.
I'm starting to see signs here that it may be time to move on. No raises in three years..."fix on failure" maintenance methods, and they're not replacing outgoing personnel. All signs point towards a serious cash crunch, and there's no longer anyone under me on paid staff to let go. If it happens in my department, I'm next. :(
I'm at that point when I need to decide if it's time to find a new job or to finally break down and become an entrepreneur. What criteria do you use to determine that it's time to move on or start that business?
What are warning signs to look for? What cues do you pick up on?
I'll give some examples from my own life: When I attended post-high school classes, I also worked a menial day job. It was obvious that it was time to move on once I completed schooling and got the licensing I needed. My next job, I was "asked to resign" because of an ongoing investigation and that "it may be in my best interest to remove myself from employment". The job after that, I was also asked to leave. I was employed the next day, for higher pay and stayed with that employer, reaching management level.
I stayed at that job for 4 years, and it became increasingly frustrating because I wasn't compensated at the same level with the same training as everyone else, yet I was continually made to fulfill those tasks. By this time, I had enough skills to make myself marketable, and moved on to the next job.
The next job was one I really liked because I had a much greater involvement with clients, I was free to determine how best to proceed with any given task, and I had interaction with other professionals as well on a daily basis. One accusation of wrong doing, with no proof, found me stripped of that position and assigned one of the worst details imaginable for three months. I had the gut feeling my employer wanted me to quit, but the plan backfired on them because my presence at that location cut problems down by 80% when I was there. The rest of the supervisory staff noticed this immediately and began to randomize when I would be present to keep the problem level down.
I was finally assigned to a better location that required a degree of skill in another language as well as good customer relation skills. This position was a lateral transfer for a slight pay increase. I was there for about a year until the position that got my foot into the bank's door opened. I moved on because as long as I stayed in my present position, I would advance no further and receive no increase in pay due to the incident.
When I was at the bank, it became immediately obvious that "Max knows how to find problems and get them solved." I spent three years supervising a staff of six, and finding and correcting problems. After those three years, my manager, at the direction of his manager, sent me to the main data processing facility to be their eyes and ears since I did my previous position well.
The position I filled was made vacant because that person was going to be moved to another position within the company. However, that was also the beginning of the second taste of "workplace politics" I had received.
The person I replaced ended up replacing my manager who resigned unexpectedly under "a cloud of mystery". He was not happy about the new position, and as my new direct supervisor, also resented my for replacing the person he had "hand picked" to succeed him. Shortly thereafter, as my new boss, he attempted to strip me of position and wanted to terminate me. The manager directly over him did a "Oh no you will NOT get rid of Max. Max will be coming back to headquarters and will take the desk directly in front of me." So, instead of losing favor, I received more of it, and was moved into administration with direct supervision over other managers and the related staff. My pay froze temporarily, and the manager who wanted me back at headquarters attempted to craft an appropriate position to get me from under the manager who didn't like me. That plan failed when a senior manager did a nepotism move and filled the position with an unqualified family member. This frustrated both the manager who wanted me, and my immediate manager.
Fast forward three years.
A new supervisor was put into place between the manager who didn't like me and himself. Every six months, the supervisor in that position would quit or request transfer out when they learned that I was paid more than them. I continued to receive pay raises despite my immediate manger's objections. His manager no longer would filter work through my manager, and instead would assign me directly, and I am now the head investigator for the electronic security division and writing training manuals for entire departments.
Managers above me were known to hand in my work as their own, and yet I still produced tremendous amount of data and doing investigations daily. When the manager who wanted me to work for him moved on. I should have taken that as a cue to move on, but didn't.
It took three months, and a case of sleep deprivation to cause me to not dot one "I", and my manager immediately jumped on that to use it to fire me. A one month severance was given to me very reluctantly, but they had to do so under contract. I used that time to find employment, and did so before the package ran dry.
My last employer lied to me from the start. I was paid less than what the position was advertised for, I was given duties other than what was agreed upon at hire, and I never received any increase in pay despite glowing reports from any and all clients and managers I came into contact with. I moved on because the television production studio I was volunteering my services at decided they needed to hire me on full time, and it allowed me to utilize training and expertise I hadn't used in a while.
I'm starting to see signs here that it may be time to move on. No raises in three years..."fix on failure" maintenance methods, and they're not replacing outgoing personnel. All signs point towards a serious cash crunch, and there's no longer anyone under me on paid staff to let go. If it happens in my department, I'm next. :(
I'm at that point when I need to decide if it's time to find a new job or to finally break down and become an entrepreneur. What criteria do you use to determine that it's time to move on or start that business?
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M$6 Answers
That is such a vast question. More book-length answers have been written about it over the years than you'd be able to count in a day. We're talking a pile of career/entrepreneur advice manuals higher than the Sears Tower.
Most of it boils down to "what's your basic nature", because life in an organization is so utterly, completely different from life as an entrepreneur, and although entrepreneurship gets a lot of good hype, in fact lots of people are way more happy, more productive, and make more money as part of an organization that they ever would as an entrepreneur.
Given that I don't know you personally, and therefore can't make any valid guestimates on your basic nature, it's hard to advise, but I can tell you what I'd do:
1) In an employment situation, the only time you should be thinking about the job when not at work is during the commute there and back.
Any more than that and there's a problem that has to be fixed, or it's time to move on. They already get enough of your time.
2) Conversely, as an entrepreneur, it will grow to occupy 100% of your waking time.
From the minute you wake up to the minute you go to sleep you will be thinking about your business on some level, full time, seven days a week, so don't do it unless it's something you're so passionate about that you just can't stand not giving it a tackle.
And have lots of money in the bank, because....
2.a) You probably won't make a profit for the first couple'a years. For most startups, they don't start pulling a profit until some time between the third to the fifth year.
That's about all I have to offer in such limited time and space. Any more and it will grow to become yet another book-length tome to toss onto to the mile-high stack of career-advice books already in existence.
So, once more time and In a nutshell, my rules of thumb are: i) If in an employment situation and if fretting about the job more than on the commute there and back, then it's time to change, ii) don't do the entrepreneurship unless it's something you're so passionate about that you *want* to be thinking about it 24/7, and iii) if you decide to go for the entrepreneurship, make sure you can support yourself from savings and investments for at least two years because you probably won't start pulling a profit until year three... maybe even year five.
Good luck with your decision.
Most of it boils down to "what's your basic nature", because life in an organization is so utterly, completely different from life as an entrepreneur, and although entrepreneurship gets a lot of good hype, in fact lots of people are way more happy, more productive, and make more money as part of an organization that they ever would as an entrepreneur.
Given that I don't know you personally, and therefore can't make any valid guestimates on your basic nature, it's hard to advise, but I can tell you what I'd do:
1) In an employment situation, the only time you should be thinking about the job when not at work is during the commute there and back.
Any more than that and there's a problem that has to be fixed, or it's time to move on. They already get enough of your time.
2) Conversely, as an entrepreneur, it will grow to occupy 100% of your waking time.
From the minute you wake up to the minute you go to sleep you will be thinking about your business on some level, full time, seven days a week, so don't do it unless it's something you're so passionate about that you just can't stand not giving it a tackle.
And have lots of money in the bank, because....
2.a) You probably won't make a profit for the first couple'a years. For most startups, they don't start pulling a profit until some time between the third to the fifth year.
That's about all I have to offer in such limited time and space. Any more and it will grow to become yet another book-length tome to toss onto to the mile-high stack of career-advice books already in existence.
So, once more time and In a nutshell, my rules of thumb are: i) If in an employment situation and if fretting about the job more than on the commute there and back, then it's time to change, ii) don't do the entrepreneurship unless it's something you're so passionate about that you *want* to be thinking about it 24/7, and iii) if you decide to go for the entrepreneurship, make sure you can support yourself from savings and investments for at least two years because you probably won't start pulling a profit until year three... maybe even year five.
Good luck with your decision.
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M$Report Abuse
Simply put, when the challenge in your current position is not motivating enough for you to wake up and go to work...it is time. Your mind needs to be challenged with your profession and not politics. Political drama in the workplace as of late is a real problem and due to our economy making people work in places where they are not happy.
From your writing above, it seems that you have been handed the short stick and not being accredited with your output...a definite sign to move on.
With everything you have stated, it is obvious....u are pissed off, unhappy, unmotivated.....THUS it is time for you to move on.
As for going out on your own...hard for me to gauge since that is very industry specific.
From your writing above, it seems that you have been handed the short stick and not being accredited with your output...a definite sign to move on.
With everything you have stated, it is obvious....u are pissed off, unhappy, unmotivated.....THUS it is time for you to move on.
As for going out on your own...hard for me to gauge since that is very industry specific.
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M$
Good question.
Your story sets me thinking. I have been thinking on similar question before.
I have also encountered many “office politics” during my career life. Seems like it’s the norm in career. Sigh.
Some humble opinions:
Some “framework” or “theories” that maybe useful:
1. Maslow’s Hierachy of Needs. Consider where you are now.
2. Consider your life as different resource accounts of wealth, health (physical & mental), knowledge, family (quality time with family), network (for e.g friends), reputation. Consider your current position in these accounts. Time is the only resource everyone have equally. The others some may endow with more. Life is a process of one resource in exchange of other resources.
The reasons we work in current position vs new position/entrepreneurship:
relatively higher increase in wealth (monetary gain/protection); in health (like the job, fulfilment); knowledge (good training); network (colleagues, mentors, friends etc..); reputation (ethics, awards, titles, trustworthiness, diligence etc..).
3. Utility concept and diminishing utility
Importance of different accounts is different for different peoples depends on its current position in the account. Its utility diminishes once in relative abundance, for e.g increment of $100 per month is a good incentive for a person in need of money but not good incentive for a wealthy person; an extra 1 hr rest is a good incentive for a person with bad health compared to one with good health..
4. Evaluation of skillset needs and gaps for your current job and the new job/entrepreneurship that you desired.
This determines how easily you switch to another job or become an entrepreneur. Beware of becoming an entrepreneur just to exit from a bad job. Make sure you have the relevant skillsets required or be able to seek help for skillsets that you lack. It’s good that someone can acquire these skills while still holding a job (and acquire wealth, knowledge, network, reputation which will be useful in entrepreneurship).
5. Cost-benefit analysis
Considering all resource accounts cost-benefit, its utility to you and evaluation of skillset need. Choose the best option available.
6. Some other ideas:
Uphold your “reputation”, don’t let it smear your track record. Get hold of data that can prove your innocence. I think reputation is very important when you move very high up.
Make sure you get all deserved references and severance package if leaving the company.
Be financially free so that you don’t have to worry about money and free to utilize your potentials.
What is the field that you intend to venture into ?
I have compiled some entrepreneurship resources in my blog’s bloglists.
John Nesheim’s book is good.
(I wonder whether there is a way to discuss (like a forum) besides “comment” in Mahalo.
“Comment” may not be directly relevant to the question posed.)
Your story sets me thinking. I have been thinking on similar question before.
I have also encountered many “office politics” during my career life. Seems like it’s the norm in career. Sigh.
Some humble opinions:
Some “framework” or “theories” that maybe useful:
1. Maslow’s Hierachy of Needs. Consider where you are now.
2. Consider your life as different resource accounts of wealth, health (physical & mental), knowledge, family (quality time with family), network (for e.g friends), reputation. Consider your current position in these accounts. Time is the only resource everyone have equally. The others some may endow with more. Life is a process of one resource in exchange of other resources.
The reasons we work in current position vs new position/entrepreneurship:
relatively higher increase in wealth (monetary gain/protection); in health (like the job, fulfilment); knowledge (good training); network (colleagues, mentors, friends etc..); reputation (ethics, awards, titles, trustworthiness, diligence etc..).
3. Utility concept and diminishing utility
Importance of different accounts is different for different peoples depends on its current position in the account. Its utility diminishes once in relative abundance, for e.g increment of $100 per month is a good incentive for a person in need of money but not good incentive for a wealthy person; an extra 1 hr rest is a good incentive for a person with bad health compared to one with good health..
4. Evaluation of skillset needs and gaps for your current job and the new job/entrepreneurship that you desired.
This determines how easily you switch to another job or become an entrepreneur. Beware of becoming an entrepreneur just to exit from a bad job. Make sure you have the relevant skillsets required or be able to seek help for skillsets that you lack. It’s good that someone can acquire these skills while still holding a job (and acquire wealth, knowledge, network, reputation which will be useful in entrepreneurship).
5. Cost-benefit analysis
Considering all resource accounts cost-benefit, its utility to you and evaluation of skillset need. Choose the best option available.
6. Some other ideas:
Uphold your “reputation”, don’t let it smear your track record. Get hold of data that can prove your innocence. I think reputation is very important when you move very high up.
Make sure you get all deserved references and severance package if leaving the company.
Be financially free so that you don’t have to worry about money and free to utilize your potentials.
What is the field that you intend to venture into ?
I have compiled some entrepreneurship resources in my blog’s bloglists.
John Nesheim’s book is good.
(I wonder whether there is a way to discuss (like a forum) besides “comment” in Mahalo.
“Comment” may not be directly relevant to the question posed.)
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
Great.. Glad to know that many aspects of your new venture are ready.
Equipment wise, is normal HD digital camera sufficient ? I don’t know much abt this field but just thought that current HD digital camera is great. Wonder whether there is an equipment leasing market too. Insights from others' similar ventures may be useful.
Good luck to your new venture. Hope that you can put your “teaser” clip here :-)
It maybe a good marketing tool.
Funny enough, three times in the last two days, people at work have asked me when I was going to start a business. I think with the long weekend ahead, I'll get more solid ideas down on paper.
The field will be in video, somewhat similar to what I do now. I've noticed a real need for something, and I have the skills to fulfill that need. What I lack at the moment is the equipment to move forward. I have enough contacts to access a few methods of distribution, but without the equipment and marketing of the (product or service), I'm dead in the water before I start.
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If you are unhappy working for someone else and hate your job then I would say that it a HUGE sign. I started my own business (well psychological practice) as soon as I completed my PhD because I knew I couldn't be happy working for others. Some of us wither away under the thumb of someone else and we need to branch out on our own to bloom.
In my practice I can make my own decisions and side step the drama that occurs in larger businesses. Believe me it is so much better to actually focus on the work that you do instead of all the personality conflicts and work drama that can be so frustrating.
I think you owe it to yourself to try to start your own company because if you don't you may always wish you had or wonder what would have been.
I think most people get to the point where they just get so fed up with being told what to do or being taken advantage of. When you get to that point, it is time to move on to something new. It is certainly a good motivator because you don't want to have to go back to the place you were mistreated.
In my practice I can make my own decisions and side step the drama that occurs in larger businesses. Believe me it is so much better to actually focus on the work that you do instead of all the personality conflicts and work drama that can be so frustrating.
I think you owe it to yourself to try to start your own company because if you don't you may always wish you had or wonder what would have been.
I think most people get to the point where they just get so fed up with being told what to do or being taken advantage of. When you get to that point, it is time to move on to something new. It is certainly a good motivator because you don't want to have to go back to the place you were mistreated.
source(s):
personal experience
personal experience
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M$
I've had a business idea that has been forming out of frustration with the lack of available and quality of material at work as well. I don't want to go into specifics, but I do see a lack of timely information, and I believe that given the proper attention, could be turned into something good and profitable.
It would also solve the "the things you generate here belong to US, and you get no further recognition for it" problem.
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With the ongoing economic crisis it's only logical to have a back-up plan on the ready. We never know when we are going to get laid off from work, or be forced to resign in case an emergency occurs.
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M$
I think at following time we decide that it's time to find a new job / become an entrepreneur!!!!!!
1) When you finished your studies and sit at home whole day
2) When you have not another job
3) When you have fired from your first job
4) When you not much money even you have buy a hotdog
5) When you want to purchase a mobile,i phone ,computer,bike
and you have not money!!!!!!
6) When you are not able to take your girlfriend on a trip.
7) When your father get retuirment
8) And most important when your children get hungry and your are not able to
feed them!!!!!!
1) When you finished your studies and sit at home whole day
2) When you have not another job
3) When you have fired from your first job
4) When you not much money even you have buy a hotdog
5) When you want to purchase a mobile,i phone ,computer,bike
and you have not money!!!!!!
6) When you are not able to take your girlfriend on a trip.
7) When your father get retuirment
8) And most important when your children get hungry and your are not able to
feed them!!!!!!
You can leave an optional "tip" with Mahalo's virtual currency, Mahalo Dollars. If you are asking a difficult question that might require some research, or if you'd like a wide variety of feedback, a higher tip often leads to more answers to your question.
M$
